Service Dept Misinformation

I am in the dealer service waiting room right now. My 2008 CR-V has 10,228 miles on it and the maintenance minder says 5%. I am really disappointed that the service manager was trying to tell me that the maintenance minder is for things other than oil changes and that I could be ruining the engine because I didn't bring it in at 5,000 "like I was supposed to." I told him that he should check the manual because you don't have to change the oil until the car tells you to. Why should I have to tell HIM this? He showed me the "Honda Village Maintenance Chart" which clearly shows oil changes every 5,000 miles. I politely told him that they had a custom one made up because if they had everyone wait 10,000 miles they would lose a good percentage of income. On their chart, it has the 10,000 maintenance as $134.95 and it includes a whole list of things, the same as the 50,000 mile service. Unfortunately, I did not read ahead of time what I should be paying for because I incorrectly assumed that the dealer would go according to the manual and not according to some inflated money making maintenance schedule. So now I am paying $134.95 for my first maintenance. At least they have free wireless.

Has anyone else run into anything like this?

BS from the dealers are standard fare! Not that it will do any good but you could report the incident to Honda Corporate. You are indeed correct, you are to follow the MMI not some home made chart (however pretty in the dealer waiting room).

Here is another thread related to your experience:

http://www.crvownersclub.com/forums/t3860-5/

Read post 45 on page 5.

Hang in there with the leaching S.O.B.s.

Welcome to the club.

In Ontario all the dealers do it GM,Toyota and when I got my V Pickering Honda handed me theirs in a nice plastic folder.They had all made up their own maintainance folders and charts and time intervals.I got robbed once at GM after that when I take any vehicle in I take the manufactures warranty book with me and show it to them and say that is what I want done nothing else.The only one that argued was Toyota until I explained that they don't design ,manufacture or warranty the vehicle Toyota does so do what they recommend.The Cavalier I had 80 K when I sold it and the Rav4 had over 100 K and nothing bad happened with either.The nice plastic folders they give their maintanance recommendations in are great for keeping you lottery tickets in.

When I brought my Honda in to replace a tire and rim (hit road debris); I asked if I should go ahead and change the oil since it was already at 40% and 5200 miles. They said No; wait until the MM tells you so. Looks like I got a honest dealer.

In Ontario all the dealers do it GM,Toyota and when I got my V Pickering Honda handed me theirs in a nice plastic folder.They had all made up their own maintainance folders and charts and time intervals.I got robbed once at GM after that when I take any vehicle in I take the manufactures warranty book with me and show it to them and say that is what I want done nothing else.The only one that argued was Toyota until I explained that they don't design ,manufacture or warranty the vehicle Toyota does so do what they recommend.The Cavalier I had 80 K when I sold it and the Rav4 had over 100 K and nothing bad happened with either.The nice plastic folders they give their maintanance recommendations in are great for keeping you lottery tickets in.

In Hondas case in Canada they provide us with the maint schedule and suggested pricing for the services. The dealer flyers for the services are even supplied by Honda. If you comapre this chart to what your dealer gave you they should be pretty close if not identical.

Honda Canada (http://honda.ca/HondaCA2006/YourHonda/HondaService/MaintCalcSched.asp?year=2006&modelid=8&minder=False&TrimID=239&L=E)

In Hondas case in Canada they provide us with the maint schedule and suggested pricing for the services. The dealer flyers for the services are even supplied by Honda. If you comapre this chart to what your dealer gave you they should be pretty close if not identical.

Honda Canada (http://honda.ca/HondaCA2006/YourHonda/HondaService/MaintCalcSched.asp?year=2006&modelid=8&minder=False&TrimID=239&L=E)

I took a quick look and the first thing I saw was the dealers oil change recommendation of 8000 km or 4 months which ever comes first but the Honda book that came with the V says 16000 km or one year which ever comes first.That was enough for me especially when they called and e-mailed me after 6 months saying that my V needed service.The dealers 16000 km recommends everything that Honda does for 32000 km.Sorry Lizzurd but even with all your experience I have to disagree.

I took a quick look and the first thing I saw was the dealers oil change recommendation of 8000 km or 4 months which ever comes first but the Honda book that came with the V says 16000 km or one year which ever comes first.That was enough for me especially when they called and e-mailed me after 6 months saying that my V needed service.The dealers 16000 km recommends everything that Honda does for 32000 km.Sorry Lizzurd but even with all your experience I have to disagree.

Looking at the link i posted Honda calls for the same service at 16000 as they do at 32000.

Sorry to hear but not surprised about your experience at all. You might want to try another dealer next time.

However 10,ooo miles seems kind of extreme between oil changes even under ideal conditions. I myself will not let it go that long just to be on the safe side the first oil change. Being that green is not going to help you pay for a new short block at 100,000 miles. It will only help you save a few quarts of oil!

If you specified "oil change" at the dealer you might have a case in principle. In practice it might not really be worth any legal action or complaint on the grounds of ‘sneaky and underhanded practices’. You get my drift.

At one time Volvo used to specify that the first oil change be done at 1,500 miles. As I was told it had something to do with removing any break-in particles suspended in the oil. Thereafter it called for the more typical 4,500 miles. I forgot exactly as it has been a long time. The rear differential was to be done too at such a low interval. Since then manufacturers have opted to raise the interval to longer and longer mileage as a convenience factor. However you would never believe how many metal shavings from the manufacturing process I drained out of a very low mileage German made Ford once in the early seventies. Thus to this date I have leaned toward the “Volvo principle”.

Unless a special break-in oil is used by the manufacturer, why wait that long? I tend to as a rule on all my new vehicles rarely ever go over 5,000 miles the first oil change. Even if driving in ideal conditions. Toyota and GM as well as most manufacturers cut the interval in half under stop and go, dusty dirt road conditions or when driving below a certain temperature. That is why when my CR-V salesman said to follow the oil monitor on the CR-V, well I was very skeptical.

While the mileage, MPG and oil life indicator seem an impressively accurate display, in the owner’s manual page 257 where it discusses how the oil life is calculated, it does not seem to take into account the amount of dust or dirt road conditions you are driving in. How would they measure that? This should be a 1st order effect yet it is not even mentioned. Even using Mobil 1 synthetic that is currently guaranteed for 15,000 miles I do not like to go over 7,500 mile here in New England. I’m more of a touchy-feely squeeze the oil between the fingers and see what it feels like – what color it is kind of guy. Up to say 5-7k miles then I plan on changing it soon. For those that do not like getting oil on their fingers, well then they should by all means use the indicator. It beats guessing in lue of any records.

See the following site for CR-V recommendations by Mobil1 site:

What's the right oil for my car? (http://www.mobiloil.com/usa-english/motoroil/car_care/which_oil/WhichOilOption1.aspx)

Another interesting site:

Castrol SYNTEC Torture Chamber (http://www.castrolsyntec.com/Torture-Chamber.aspx)

Then click on [Media System] if you like reality shows. Or poke around.

After the first oil change, I will probably opt for the later Mobil1 recommendation here in New England where it drops below 20F often during winter. Changing engine oil once a year or every 5-7k miles whichever comes first. Depending on how it looks and feels. None of this it is the life of your engine every 3k or 3 months kind of thing. I stopped that long ago before it was considered not 'green' or cost $6 a quart or more. And no I do not have any Mobil or Castrol Stock. The oil indicator to me is just sort of another last resort reminder gizmo. So you do not drive another 6k miles after dropping your car off for an oil change and never having it done. It happens more than you think! If you reset the indicator yourself then it does not help in this case either.

But that is just my opinion. And opinions are like A-holes. Everyone has one. :):

As Stanley Goodspeed (Nicholas Cage in "The Rock") might have said in a hopelessly similar situation - "I Just… just Wanna-Have fresh oil" :mad: (instead of “Wanna find some rockets”)

-RG

I forgot, my dealer does the first oil change for free as a good will gesture and to try to get you to come back for scheduled service!

Can't beat that.

With any luck the warranty will run out before it needs any work. It should based on CU reliability data. Most PM I can do myself. I can even read any error codes that may not turn on the MIL light using my AutoTap scanner. That is if it works on Hondas. Never tried before. Check out:

AutoTap - OBDII Diagnostic Scanner (http://www.autotap.com/)

Those of you that are not adept or do not like getting greasy, well then I guess you pay what ever the market will bear. :eek: :(

Looking at the link i posted Honda calls for the same service at 16000 as they do at 32000.

Lizzurd,.But really an oil change every 8000 km or 4 months when the manufacturer recommends 16000 km or one year.Even under Hondas severe conditions it recommends every 8000 km or SIX months.Just comparing your link to Hondas schedule in 240000 km would add up to an extra 15 oil changes at $40.00 Canadian each .Or the dealer saying every 4 months to Hondas once a year over 10 years is 30 oil changes for the dealer compared to Hondas recommended 10,even under their severe recommendations it would be 20.I only put 12000 km on a year and I change it two times.

The Honda Canada maintenance calculator is quite the chart. You almost need a lawyer to figure it out. :D The US owner’s manual does not have much info.. Nothing on oil change interval that I could find other than the MM info.

And folks straight from page 263 of the US owner’s manual:

* 1: if the message "Service" does not appear more than 12 months after the display is reset, change the oil every year.

Very interesting!
Isn't that a can of worms? I must be missing something that is not getting thru my thick skull.

Actually Canadian every 4 months recommendations may coincide with what I was referring to in my long dissertation. The environmental conditions play a very important part. If you live in an area of Canada where the summers are only weeks long followed by cool Fall then ultra long cold Winters, then you should probably change it every 4 months to be safe. That would be most of Canada except for the immediate West coast? I’ve only been to Toronto once in December-January long ago. Brrrrrr! But the ice Falls sure were beautiful!

Blow-by gasses and acid byproducts from combustion can do a number on oil below 0F ambient conditions. Condensation or moisture will turn oil into a creamy tan color (creamy in texture too). This cream will not circulate thru your engine very well at all! You will also see sludge buildup accumulating under the valve cover and elsewhere in the engine. Clogging up oil passages. Often seen with leaking head gaskets. One does not get 250,000 miles or more life expectancy out of an engine that way. Under 100,000 is more like it.

AH! Use an oil testing service. You mail in a sample and a few weeks later you get back a detailed report. That should clarify the condition of your oil and can indicate any problems that might be developing. Such as worm bearings etc. I got one free once. I think they sell for maybe $40-60 for a six pack or dozen. Not really sure at today’s prices. Normally done after an oil change by fleet maintenance for say UPS. Where they want to get 500,000 minimum on their engines. Tractor trailer deisels often go well over 1 million miles a driver recently told me once. His rig had well over 900,000 mi. he said. These are the types that use fluid testing services. They do A/T too!

-RG