[chidog]

Fuel is not the preventative for head gasket failure on these. Its the improper design of the engine deck that is the issue, and that would be a costly fix.

Most all manufactures are not following good design practices for turbo charged engines. Many brands having these same issues.

 

[chidog]

Total noob here...we are original owners of a hybrid 2021 CRV, 83K. We are being told about $4000 for a blown head gasket. Reading through the thread, my current question is do I care if they are sending something away to be 'machined' as part of the repair? Doesn't this mean they are rebuilding rather than replacing? And then because maybe I still need to rant - Is it worth it to get a second opinion from a different dealer? Or to try to find a private mechanic? Why do we have a blown head gasket with only 83K miles? We've had no signs of overheating, have only ever used the dealership for all scheduled service. About a month ago, one episode of power loss, took it to the dealer, no codes, no help. Week or two later, a new power loss episode with a valve-sounding problem. This time there were codes and they replaced all the spark plugs, cleaned valves. Within a day or two, oil leaking on the garage floor, so we take it back in. Something they changed out was bad so they replaced it, no charge. Power loss again yesterday, drove it to the dealer. Today we are told there is coolant leaking through the head gasket into a valve, time to replace the head gasket. Could the mechanic have broken the head gasket somehow? Was that the problem from the beginning and they just didn't notice the coolant leak when they changed out the spark plugs? Any thoughts that can help me feel better about this are welcome.

My post above was not a baseless rant, it is true that the deck or top surface of the engine block where the head gasket goes is a very bad design, and like I say some other brands have the problems as well. That is the reason for the failure.
The only thing a mechanic could do to make a problem would be loosen the head bolts, but I don't think they would purposely do that to cause an issue. It likely has been slowly degrading by itself.

The something they would send away to be machined is the head, reason to make sure its straight on the gasket surface. Problem is if it is warped real bad it could need some extensive work, depending on if they can straighten it first. I'd think a new head then may be a cheaper fix.

 

[chidog]

My crv has gotten to the point where I have to tear it down and do the head gasket. I've created a list below of parts I am ordering, is there anything else I'm forgetting or I should do while I'm in there? 2017 exl 1.5T, 142k miles.

-two step performance head studs
-cometic MLS head gasket
-new injectors (anyone have a good source for new ones besides the dealership?)
-intake gaskets
-throttle body gasket
-turbo gasket
-valve cover gasket
-water pump pipe seal
-honda bond or rtv for the timing cover
-coolant

Oil and oil filter, some coolant seems to end up in the sump when disassembling the top.

 

[chidog]

Could be an improvement with higher octane because, the ECU will then be able to advance the timing. More power means more pressure the head gasket then see's. More power is not something that will help a week area that the gasket has to keep sealed.

 

[chidog]

Yes the pinging does cause more heat and pressure too, so arresting that is a good thing.

 

[chidog]

If the solution to the head gasket issue (rare or not) is simply stronger head bolts one would think Honda would have or has made the change. Even if the warranty costs aren’t high there’s still the whole reputation thing.

Only part of the solution.

It is difficult to fix stupid. (engineering)
Seems to be running rampant in all auto brands these days.

 

[chidog]

Let us know what happens.

 

[chidog]

2021 Honda CRV Hybrid. Head gasket failure at 65k miles. Just out of warranty. Engine block needs to be machined as well. ~$4k

$4K for what? At todays shop prices that is about $2k or more to just remove and reinstall the engine. To machine the engine block it needs to be completely disassembled, with parts and labor that is probably another $5K, so that is a $7K adventure. Was that at a dealer? I'd be questioning that.

 

[chidog]

2 very conflicting prices. One at $17,000. and another at $4000. I'm lost.

 

[chidog]

......and my Fuel Injectors died as the tech was doing a test drive after fixing the head gasket. Just my luck

Sorry but that makes zero sense. They will not all fail just like that. It maybe a fuse, relay or wire problem. Though bad gas, water etc. can be an issue.
Sounds like someone is padding the bill, maybe on the next test drive the, transmission will fail.?

 

[chidog]

I had the same issue, multiple lights on the dashboard at 180,000Km.
I took it to a dealership and they’ve replaced the head gasket and injectors (resurfacing). Very huge bill, CAD $ 9,700.
How is your car running after the repairs? Is time to sell it? 😀😀😀 I don’t think I am buying any Honda car again or a 1.5

Sounds like your happy with dealer prices. Not buying a honda ? Doesn't matter what brand it is, nowadays this sort of thing is the norm.

 

[chidog]

Fun paying for their mess up, and techs with $50k tools etc. that know very little. Sorry to hear about this.

 

[chidog]

The modern electronic controls if working properly will not allow the engine to knock, and does not matter what the octane rating is. The knock sensor will send the signal, and the ECU will derate the engine, backing down on the timing, etc. to stop it from pinging or detonating.

 

[chidog]

You do realize that it's not good for a motor to run continuously retarded, right?

Its much better than what happens if not retarded. What does it hurt? The ECU alters the fuel map for that condition, that is the whole reason for EFI.
You don't need "full potential" on a soccer mom vehicle, CRV's are not performance cars. Besides the bad design won't take "full potential".
Save your No2 for a project drag car.

 

[chidog]

As I'm an old fart, I learned to drive with manual transmissions and cars and trucks without computers, but had a distributor to turn to adjust ignition timing. I also learned NEVER to allow the engine to ping at low RPM, and you never, ever lugged the engine. IF an old engine did ping, better fuel was the fix, if timing was in range. When first driving the 1.5 CRV and noticing the low RPM at which it operates at times, I felt the requirement for higher octane was overlooked or ignored because of electronic "nannies" that were supposed to take care of such things. Me, I use better fuel and "S" range to keep the revs up at slow speeds.

Me too, and still mostly drive manual car. I have never had an engine with a working knock sensor ping or knock. Even on my performance mod truck in highschool days I could not afford high octane stuff, and there was no cars then with electronic engine controls, so yeah had to keep the advance backed down a bit. Someone mentioned "hurts head gaskets" yeah when the deck interface is designed like they do on pretty much all the new auto engines now, especially open deck. Its called manufacturing cheap cheap.

 

[chidog]

This should be a recall just like all the problems with say Kia, at least they do the right thing and recall them. This is a design and manufacturing defect. And a failed engine at highway speeds could not end well. That qualifys it as recall.

 

[chidog]

Some times best to pocket any $ insurance costs and pay out of pocket. Just faster.

 

[chidog]

Don't want to get off topic - but seeing rampant issues with this engine across the industry makes me want to stay away from it in the future. 2.0l hybrid or J V6 only.

Gut engineer feeling is telling me the open deck design, and 87 octane fuel in a turbocharged application is a recipe for eventual engine failure down the road. Sticking with my 2010 2.4l K24.

Open deck is every Honda engine now made and years ago too, even the K24's, and many many more brands as well. Its fast and cheap to do.

 

[chidog]

With a computerized fuel and ignition system designed to automatically adjust for fuel grade. I can't see how using a different octane rating fuel it going to fix an engineering and manufacturing defect.

 

[chidog]

Too much monkey see monkey do in the auto motive engineering world now. Also the wives tails don't help either.

Maybe its time to toss out the computer design systems and go back to slide rules, and more trips to the work (edit in work) shops like in days of old.

And no more thinking cutting corners will save money. It doesn't when you spend thousands of times more money on replacements and recalls.