[williamsji]

The Rav4 Prime will qualify for federal tax credits (likely ~$5K-$6K) whereas the CRV Hybird...doesn't.

Not if Toyota has already reached their volume limit on the tax credit. And with the limited range (39 miles), it may not qualify for the full tax credit regardless.

Federal Tax Credits for Electric and Plug-in Hybrid Cars

Save up to $7,500 on qualifying vehicles!

www.fueleconomy.gov

It may, or it may not. I encourage people to research first before committing to buy.

 

[williamsji]

The 2019 Rav4 has a traditional oil filter, not like the Tacoma featured in the below video, but the Rav4 calls for 0W-16 full synthetic. Good luck getting that oil at Walmart or anywhere other than a Toyota dealer. It's an undeniably shameless cash grab. Makes me think whoever is running Toyota Motor Corporation has a lot of experience in taxation and government-sanctioned racketeering.

Most Japanese manufacturers haver already moved to 0W-16 in their Japan fleets... and are now beginning to proliferate across their markets. It is an industry move, not some cash grab conspiracy. So.. 0W-16 is inevitable for most new generation vehicles.

Sure.. 0W-16 will be a bit difficult to source economically initially in the US... but the oil producers will quickly fill that void as demand from home mechanics kicks in. So your concern expressed is temporary at worst.

 

[williamsji]

If the Rav4 Prime can get within a grand or two of the CRV in similar trim, there is no way I'd buy the CRV next year.

Extra 25% power would be an amazing thing in this size of vehicle.

If I recall correctly, RAV4s generally cost a good bit more for the same trim/features compared to a CRV, and have for some years now. I think the only thing that could make the RAV4 plugin hybrid cross over the price curve to compete with the CRV would be if it is eligible for a solid tax credit. There is more advantage in price for a plugin hybrid RAV4 in states like California who also have a tax credit to add on top of whatever federal EPA tax credit the RAV4 ends up qualifying for.

I agree more horsepower will appeal to some owners, yet they will pay a price for that both in purchase and in ongoing costs since more horsepower is never free.... even in a plug-in hybrid.

Personally, I would pass on the mid-life refresh CRV hybrid and wait for the 2022 full refresh as it will be a better a brand new generation, and when comparing to the 2021 RAV4.... it is a better objective comparison of essentially current generation offerings by both companies. When the new CRV comes out, it may very well once again blow away the newest generation RAV4. Time will tell of course.

 

[williamsji]

Agreed... except the 2021 RAV4 Hybrid Prime Plug-in will be WAY more expensive than the 2020 CRV Hybrid.

I'm guessing the RAV4 Prime will be at least US$55,000 out-the-door.

And if there's no tax credit?

My estimated price breakdown:
-- $37k for 2020 RAV4 Hybrid Limited
-- Add $10k for 302hp Prime Plug-in package
-- Add $3k for option packages (Tech, Weather, Protective)
-- Add $2k for typical extras
-- Tax, license, registration, delivery, extended warranty.
-- Maybe ~$3k dealer markup.

That is, initially I bet the RAV4 Prime is offered only on a restricted-availability loaded top-of-the-line Limited model.

And even if it's eventually offered on a base model, I expect the RAV4 Prime will still be $10k-ish more expensive than a comparable CRV Hybrid.

No thanks.

Instead, to replace my current 2011 CRV SE AWD, I'll be looking for a base CRV Hybrid hopefully around $30k.

Most of your assumptions are fairly reasonable, though I think your end result number is too high... and they will sell in other trims besides Limited. I'm guessing more in the range of $40K-42K, not $55K.

That said, I do know in California they will be popular with die hard RAV4 fans.. and so they will not be selling any at discount for a good amount of time unless it gets bad reviews like the rollout of the latest gen RAV4-non-hybrid. Same will be true for the gen6 CRV when it comes out the following year.. and if Honda forward marketing plans are any indicator.. the gen6 CRV may very well also offer a plugin version as well as a standard hybrid. Honda specifically states they want to be out of the normal gas engine powertrains by late 2020s... and so far they appear to be moving in that direction on plan.

 

[williamsji]

So you make a whole bunch of assumptions to come to your conclusion. Seems smart.

Thing is... every comment so far ARE assumptions being presented as such.

It's just that personal bias tends to color assumptions (and rejection of assumptions) when facts on a new vehicle are absent.

 

[williamsji]

Well, I thought I was going to be putting down money for a 2020 CR-V Hybrid, in all likelihood, until the details of this were announced. Now I might be holding off to see how the RAV4 Prime pans out. Given I plan to move within 5-10 miles of my office next year (currently live 30 miles away), the plug-in would be right within that range. It will come down to compromises and price.

If you can hold off until the 2021 RAV4 plugin comes out... maybe wait another year until the gen6 CRV releases... as it may very well also have a plugin version in the line up. Hopefully... when Honda does release a plugin hybrid CRV... they do it world wide.. and not follow how they did the rollout of the gen5 hybrid.... in EU only for the first year or two.

 

[williamsji]

was looking at the crv hybrid but the prime looks superior in all the numbers HP, acceleration, 39 ev range (on a normal workday I won't use any gas). Edmund says the battery should be big enough to qualify for the tax credit.price should be competitive, what am I missing here.I don't consider Honda quality to be a differentiating factor any longer, maybe in the past. downside for both models would be increased complexity of dual systems and first year bugs. not sure how seamless the transition is as well sometimes it can be loud, jarring switch-over to gas.
I find myself moving along this train of thought even further. what about decreasing complexity by a large margin. increasing acceleration. Never having to pull into a gas station. Eliminating the maintenance minder because none is needed, other then tire care and some fluids. What about a Tesla model Y? yes I know the price is low 50s with no tax break instead of low 40s with a break. but is it worthy of some consideration here , what do you think?

Read the spec details closer... this is NOT and electric vehicle... it is a plugin hybrid. They are in fact different.

If you think you will never need to stop into a gas station with the 2021 plug-in hybrid.. you are either never going to drive more then 30ish or so miles a day and always plugin overnight .... or you are deluding yourself.

AND... since it still has a gas engine component.. it will still require regular gas engine maintenance. Even if you literally never drive enough distance to fire up the gas engine.. it still needs to have the oil and other fluids changed periodically.

As for Teslas.. if you think they are zero maintenance ... you have been drinking too much Elon Musk flavored coolaid.