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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
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DISCLAIMER: Alas the fine print, except it is not fine because I want you to actually read it. Use these instructions at your own risk! Read through the instructions to the end before starting any work. If there is any area that you do not understand or feel is beyond your competence, do not perform this work. You assume all responsibility for the proper and safe maintenance of your vehicle.

APPLICABILITY: The specific information in this procedure is applicable only to the 2007 US model CRV with a 2.4 liter gasoline engine with 4WD. The method should generally be applicable to any 4WD CR-V, but specific details such as the size and location of the plugs and the capacity of the fluid may differ.

The rear differential fluid should be changed when the maintenance minder displays a sub code 6. In photo 1 below, B 16 (red arrow) is displayed. This means that the tasks in maintenance schedule B should be performed but also subcode 1 (rotate tires) and subcode 6 (change the rear differential fluid). From reports of various club members, it appears as though the subcode 6 will appear between 15,000 and 20,000 miles on the second oil change.

This procedure is meant only for those owners who are changing their fluid due to the normal maintenance schedule. If your vehicle is making noise from the rear end in tight turns, especially if it is still under warranty, you should return the vehicle to your dealer and have the problem properly documented.

There are two TSBs regarding noise from the rear differential on the 07 CR-V.

http://www.in.honda.com/Rjanisis/pubs/SB/A07-021.PDF

http://www.in.honda.com/Rjanisis/pubs/SB/A07-024.PDF


If these TSBs apply to your vehicle, return the vehicle to the dealer for the proper service and warranty documentation.

To meet the minimum requirement of the service schedule, you should drain and refill the rear differential one time. TSB 07-024 does a 2X drain and refill with burnishing after the first and second refill—but this TSB is for rear differentials that have made noise. For a rear differential that has not made noise, a single drain and refill is all that is necessary. Again… if your rear differential is making noise, you should return the vehicle to the dealer and have it properly serviced to protect your warranty. This procedure is only for normal scheduled rear differential fluid changes.

Credit: I would like to thank ApriliaGuy from the Element Owner’s Club for not only developing the method used here but being kind enough to share it with the Honda on line community. ApriliaGuy’s EOC post employing photographs was the inspiration for this post and several other how to posts. Further I would like to thank Lizzurd for linking ApriliaGuy’s post to the CRV-OC.


Honda Element Owners Club Forum - View Single Post - Differential Fluid Change Info



Supplies Required: (Photo 2) (Available at your dealer or HandA)

A) 2 Quarts of Honda Dual Pump Fluid II (Capacity of the 2007 is 1.3 quarts)

B) 2 Crush Washers, 20 mm, Honda Part Number 94109 – 20000

Caution! You must use Honda Dual Pump Fluid II. Using any other fluid will result in the destruction of the clutch plates in the rear differential. (Photo 3)

Tools Required: (Photo 2)

A) 3/8" ratchet

B) 3/8" extension 3” long (optional)

C) collection pan – big enough to hold 1.3 quarts (I cut down a windshield washer fluid jug, milk jugs are too flimsy)

D) rags or paper towels

E) 5/8" Outside Diameter Hose 10’ long Weber brand available at Lowes.

F) Funnel and hose clamp also available at Lowes (Items E & F were $6.00 total)

G) Scotch Bright or a pan scrubber


Time Required: 30 to 45 minutes


Procedure:

Step 1. Change into some grubby clothes. To protect your skin from contact with the fluid, wear oil resistant gloves.

Step 2. Shut off your engine, make sure the car is in park and the brake is set.

Step 3. Collect your supplies and tools. You don't need to jack the car up. It is a little harder without the car elevated, but it is much safer. Do not jack up your car unless you are very knowledgeable on how to raise the car and support it safely.

Step 4. (Photo 4). Gather your drain pan, ratchet, 3” extension, and paper towels. Let’s take a peek in the nether regions and see what we are getting into. Photo 4 shows the rear differential and the locations of the fill and drain plugs. Each plug has a square 3/8” hole that matches the square drive of a 3/8” drive ratchet. We will use a short extension to get the ratchet head out away from the housing. Personally I hate that “righty tighty lefty loosey” nonsense. Before you climb under, set the ratchet so that it turns the extension in the counter-clockwise direction, and ratchets in the clockwise direction. Under the car, facing the wrong way, it is easy to get it backwards.

Step 5. (Photo 5) Take a piece of Scotch Bright or a pan scour pad and clean the areas around each plug. The goal is not to make it shiny, but to knock off the loose crud so that it won’t end up in your differential.

Caution! If you have driven the vehicle in the past few minutes, feel the differential housing. If it feels hot to the touch, let the differential cool some more before working on it.

Step 6. (Photo 6) OK, now the fun starts. I was totally amazed at how tight both plugs were. Make sure your ratchet is set to spin the extension Counter Clockwise and ratchet in the Clockwise direction. You really don’t want to tighten this plug. We are going to loosen the fill plug first. Why? There have been reports of being able to get the drain plug out but not the fill…a bit of a sticky wicket one would think. Alright, put the square end of the extension into the plug. Try to pay some attention to where your knuckles will end up when the plug breaks loose. Pusssshhh! Agggghhhh! Crack! Sounds like a gun going off. Use one of the paper towels to wipe up the blood from your knuckles. Don’t take the plug out, just loosen it.

Continued in the next post.

EDIT 2-12-09 Added "Outside Diameter" in step E under Required Tools. Thanks SniperD for pointing out my omission.



 

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Discussion Starter #2
Changing Rear Differential Fluid Part 2

Continued From The Above Post

Step 7. (Photo 7) Ok, same thing on the drain, except have your drain pan ready. Pusssshhhh! Crack again.

Step 8. (Photo 8) Thread the plug out and drain the oil into your drain pan.

Step 9. (Photo 9) While the fluid is draining, clean up the drain plug and replace the crush washer.

Step 10 (Photo 10) Reinstall the drain plug with the new crush washer and tighten the plug to 35 foot-pounds of torque.

Step 11 (Photo 11a & 11b) The plastic fill hose I bought was pre-cut to 10 feet which is a bit long. I cut it down to somewhere between 6 and 7 feet long. From the exterior of the rear wheel on the passenger side, I could easily see the fill plug at about 11 o’clock. I passed the hose right through the wheel and strung it along to the fill plug. It passed near the exhaust pipe, which should be cool. (photo 11a magenta lines) The 5/8" Outside Diameter makes a nice fit into the fill hole (photo 11b).

Continued next post.



 

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Discussion Starter #3
Changing Rear Differential Fluid Part 3

Continued from previous post.

Step 12 (Photo 12 a & 12b) When you open your bottle of Genuine Honda Dual Pump Fluid II (the only thing you can use), be sure to remove all of the foil seal. While her ladyship, the lovely Dame Black Pearl provided precision pouring (photo 12 a), I manned the nether regions to keep an eye on the progress (photo 12 b). Pour in the entire first quart. Then slowly add the 0.3 (9.6 ounces) of the second quart. Somewhere between 8 to 10 ounces, it started to run out of the fill hole.

Step 13 Place a new crush washer on the fill plug (photo 13 a). When the fluid runs out the fill hole, pull out the fill hose and re-install the fill plug with the new crush washer. Torque the plug to 35 ft-lbs. (photo 13 b). Remove the fill hose from the nether regions of your V. Use care not to slop fluid on the exhaust pipe or rear brake disk and calipers.

Step 14 Tightly recap the unused portion of remaining second quart. Drain the residual oil from your fill hose and store it in plastic bag so it doesn’t get dirty. Clean up the mess. Recycle the fluid. If your other scheduled services are done, reset the Maintenance Minder. (Photo 14) Record the mileage and date in your maintenance records. Keep your receipts to protect your warranty.

Photo 15: The used oil. Hmmmm! Not the greatest looking stuff. It didn’t smell bad. I checked the bottom of the pan and there was no particulate. This oil has 16,000 miles. Suburban driving, no off road, no immersions in water, and a little winter action but not excessive. I have had no noise problems.



 

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My biggest problem with the fill-with-a-tube procedure is,

there is always some fluid in the tube because it stays in the low areas....then when the tube is withdrawn it spills out (can't hold it in as I pull the tube past the wheel)

On one DPF change I tried a cheap pump...too cheap I guess because the tubes fell out of THAT and made a mess too!

Atwell "Pig-Pen" Haines ;)
'06V
NJ
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Cat Litter

Like changing oil, messes (and bloody knuckles) are part of the bonding process. When I filled mine, I wisely removed the full drain pan to avoid knocking it over. Dame Black Pearl was doing the pouring, but alas she was shooting for the mystical 1/3 quart. Somewhere before 10 oz it started running out. Its amazing how big of a splotch an ounce of oil makes.



 

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Invaluable Photo Essay

Fantastic Information Black Pearl.

Your Step-by-Step Photo Essays are the best on the web! :cool:
 

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Do the maintenance minders reset themselves? I have to reset my 04 Odyssey and wonder what I have to do when it comes time to do my oil in my 08.

Sean
 

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Discussion Starter #9
MMI Must Be Reset

The MMI must be reset. There is a procedure in the owners manual and if you follow it to the T and try it about 5 times, it will reset. At least it does for me (after 5 tries). I think the big thing is to do the steps fairly quickly. If you stop to read what to do next, the system goes out of reset mode.



 

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Different Tool

Last night I changed the dual pump fluid on our '07 V and found it to be pretty straight forward thanks to the posts in here. I never had a noise from the rear diff, but an older, wiser person once told me that "oil is cheap". So at 28,982, out with the old and in with the new. One thing I tried that seemed to work well is the fill device I had laying around for whatever reason. I think it was purchased at autozone for a couple of bucks like 3 years ago, but it worked well. You can screw it onto the plastic container of fluid and have it turned off so no fluid will come out until the yellow end is turned 1/4 turn. There is enough room to have the plastic container lay fairly flat, but still being above the level of the fill hole. Once set, a 1/4 turn and let it flow. One other thing I did was pour the .3 quart in the empty container from the full one and it just barely started to run out the fill hole when done. Keep the drain pan under your work area and not a drop spilled.
 

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Knowledgeable member not me?

Black Pearl you do a great video like this and you still say you are not one of the more knowledgeable members and you wonder why I disagree.
Fantastic job.
Jim in To
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Welcome To The Club!

Last night I changed the dual pump fluid on our '07 V and found it to be pretty straight forward thanks to the posts in here. I never had a noise from the rear diff, but an older, wiser person once told me that "oil is cheap". So at 28,982, out with the old and in with the new. One thing I tried that seemed to work well is the fill device I had laying around for whatever reason. I think it was purchased at autozone for a couple of bucks like 3 years ago, but it worked well. You can screw it onto the plastic container of fluid and have it turned off so no fluid will come out until the yellow end is turned 1/4 turn. There is enough room to have the plastic container lay fairly flat, but still being above the level of the fill hole. Once set, a 1/4 turn and let it flow. One other thing I did was pour the .3 quart in the empty container from the full one and it just barely started to run out the fill hole when done. Keep the drain pan under your work area and not a drop spilled.
Welcome to the club, and clever filling device. I bought something that somewhat resembled the yellow part of your contraption (without the hose) but using an empty oil container I was afraid it wouldn't work. I am going to keep an eye out for your contraption. Any idea where you bought it?

I am a little concerned with your mileage at your change. With an 07 your MMI should have given you a 6 subcode (for changing the rear differential fluid) somewhere between 13,000 miles and 20,000 miles. If you are not using the MMI, you should try to change the fluid every 15 to 20 K. You are exactly correct, fluid is cheap. Honda has had a good bit of trouble with the rear differentials and fluid changes are important. So keep after that rear differential fluid a little more often than 28K.

Welcome to the club and again neat oil snout!


tcturner, thanks for the kind comments, but writing a procedure for changing rear diff fluid doesn't take a whole lot of knowledge. A good camera is helpful. When you see me writing a procedure for rebuilding a transmission, then I'll agree with you. But thanks for the compliment.



 

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Rear Diff

BP,
Thanks for the welcome.... I've been reading these posts for some time now and just chimed in when I thought I had some constructive input. As far as the fill device, I'm sure it was autozone or advance where I got it. I seem to remember doing a diff oil change on my old chevy pick-up awhile ago and needing it for the 90 wt oil. As far as the MMI, I'm a 7,500 mile change guy. I've had percentages ranging from 50% to 60% at 7,500 intervals. I reset the MMI at each oil change and try and keep an eye and ear on everything else. We have had our 07 for 15 months now and so with our VIN being out of the "suspect" range for the Honda TSB I figured 30k was a good start. Besides breaking off the damn rear window squirter when it was snowing out and the somewhat less than average factory tires, we are pleased with the V. Plus it's fun to drive in the snow before the plows get out....(don't tell the wife).
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Checking Codes In The MMI

One problem with changing oil earlier than the MMI calls for is missing the subcodes being called up. If the oil life never gets down to 15%, the subcodes will not be displayed. As I mentioned above, I think most members are getting the 6 subcode for changing the rear differential fluid between 13000 and 20000 on the second oil change. With the difficulties that Honda has experienced with the rear differentials, you want to keep a good record that you have changed the fluid in the recommended intervals. Even if you have trouble after your warranty expires, you may be eligible for good will consideration if you have changed the rear differential fluid by the MMI's recommendations.

To advoid missing the codes, you can check the codes that are coming up on the next cycle. Check out post #2 on this thread:

http://www.crvownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1886



 

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I did my 2005 CRV and the rear diff is different with the fill above the drain plug. I had to remove a protection shield from the fuel evap cannister to get better access to the plugs - after that it was simple. I used a sqeegee bottle with a 8" long 1/4" Id hose shoved onto the pointed tip and put it in this way - had to fill the bottle about 4 or 5 times to get all the oil in. I had enough hose so I could tip the bottom of the bottle up get almost all the oil out each filling. Just fill until the oil starts to run out fill hole. The factory manual says, for mine, the oil level should be up to the bottom of the fill hole with the vehicle level.
 

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Ok, so I am 16K on my 07 CR-V. I took it in to get an oil change and they tell me I need a rear differential change. They charge like $100 and like $25 for tire rotation. I am in no way handy enough to do the differential change or want to do the tire rotation. Is it worth paying the dealer? Can I find cheaper elsewhere?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Changing Rear Differential Fluids

If you do have a third party change your rear differential fluid be absolutely sure that they will use only Honda Brand Dual Pump Fluid II. If they use some other fluid it will damage your rear differential and Honda will not honor a warranty repair. Extreme caution is called for. This situation occured to another member.

Read the instructions at the beginning of this thread, changing the rear differential fluid is not difficult, and the instructions are very detailed with photos. Good luck.



 

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Is that 5/8 OD (outer diameter) on the hose or ID (inner diameter). I'm a big fan of just buying exactly what somebody who knows what they are doing tells me to buy! :)

--edit
Clearly stated in step 11 it's the OD.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Outside Diameter

Is that 5/8 OD (outer diameter) on the hose or ID (inner diameter). I'm a big fan of just buying exactly what somebody who knows what they are doing tells me to buy! :)

--edit
Clearly stated in step 11 it's the OD.
I corrected step E under Required Tools. Thanks for pointing out my omission. One shouldn't wait till step 11 to find out the size hose. I appreciate you helping to make the instructions better!

Thanks again!



 

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Thanks Black Pearl and Sunny B!!! I changed my oil and rear differential fluid this afternoon. It was a breeze with the fluid container spout tube thingy that Sunny B mentioned. I didn't drop or spill any of the fluid. I purchased it at Auto-Zone. Again, thanks guys.
 
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