[BoostedV]

I wonder if I'm missing something but I haven't really seen anyone talk about the differences between the batteries used. The CRV uses Li-ion vs the Rav4 NiMH. That seems like a rather huge difference to me but yet I haven't really seen any discussion about it. I wonder if I'm a) un-informed or b) overlooked?

It’s. A)
Theres numerous threads comparing them... before we knrw specs, after we knew specs & now that its on the road.

 

[williamsji]

Actually, both types of batteries work well in a hybrid application and they each have some trade-offs between them. Li-ion are lighter weight and more compact, with superior long charge characteristics, but still are more expensive to produce and are more prone to issues at very cold temperatures. NiMH costs less, works better in very cold temperatures, but weighs more and takes more physical space for the same power output. Also, it depends on the size of battery array you need, with larger arrays still being a better choice for NiMH right now.

Here is a Toyota vs Toyota article... including comments from Toyota Chief Engineer Kaneko....since Toyota IS making use of both battery types across their product line. Lithium-ion vs. nickel-metal hydride: Toyota still likes both for its hybrids Interestingly, Kaneko states that most of the vehicles can use either battery technology in their designs.. right now.

I think at this time, Toyota prefers NiMH still for their non-plugin vehicles, since it is older and well proven technology by Toyota. They probably also have long term trusted suppliers as well (without having to fall under Elon Musks thumb with his large volume battery factories). Probably less expensive as well, at least for now. The key trade-off according to Toyota is weight+size vs performance at really cold temperatures.

Also of interest: a separate article comparing Li-ion, NiMH, and Lead Acid options for hybrid drives in motor vehicles. 3 Types of Hybrid Batteries | Hybrid Geek

 

[kloker]

Moved to Hybrid.

 

[Schmullis]

Reviews like to continually highlight these differences:
Rav4 has front seats that cool and rear seat heaters.
They also like to complain about these things in the CR-V Hybrid:

• No front seat cooling
• No rear seat heaters
• Out of date entertainment system - BUT, after you do the initial configuration, if you use Apple Carplay or Android Auto, that system is fine. I only use Waze for Navigation, but it's good having the built in Nav, should you be in the middle of nowhere and lose internet connection.

My gripes are:

1. Steering column doesn't go low enough. Also, probably too much to ask but if the column came down and the steering wheel could also articulate, that would be perfect.
2. Padding on the front arm rest - none exists at the corner, only on the top of the armrest pad
3. Center console where the shifter buttons are - could have opened that up underneath, like the Civic Sedan has for more storage.
4. Plastic Wood trim - nice idea but looks cheap. Anyone know where you can get the same look for real wood after market?
5. Two features of the European CR-V hybrid that the US doesn't have; electric folding outside mirrors and heads-up display. Those would be cool.

 

[mikefocke]

If you want a detailed plus and minus on the Rav4 hybrid then wander over to here. There you'll find about 40 likes and the same number of dislikes. But none of the dislikes are fatal for the 2019. The 2020 is a different story with the 12v battery issue. See Honda is having troubles there too.

I've owned my 2019 Rav4h for about a year and 7500 miles. Zero issues that are really serious. I was almost buying a CRV (non-hybrid) but the gas in oil issue stopped me. Plus my experience with my local Toyota dealer is better than with the local Honda dealer.

My Rav4h is the absolutely loaded Limited. $37.5k cash. Bought and driven back home 350 miles the first day to create the right deal. Now 7,500 miles and a year later I need only a safety inspection the state requires and an oil change. Not a rattle or squeak. Perfect? No, no car I've ever bought (probably ~40 in my long life) has ever been but certainly the most initially trouble free.

38.9 MPG considering the recent winter about what I expected and that it is so performant that I drive it like a Porsche and not like a Prius.

 

[Danl49]

Mike: great write up of your likes & dislikes, thanks! . I'll be replacing my '15 Subaru Outback with a hybrid in about a year - R4, CRV & Kia Sedona are in the running. I hope someone on this CR-V site will take the time and effort to do a similar comprehensive write up for the CR-VH

 

[mikefocke]

And keep in mind the Rav4 hybrid is going to come out with a Prime version in the next 6 months that is plug-in and about 50 HP more powerful. When that comes out under current conditions is an unknown. And they will have huge dealer markups at first is being predicted. But at least some tax rebate. Pricing not available yet. All this while gas is cheap makes a rational decision almost impossible.

 

[dingo_0]

besides comparable fuel economy between crv and rav4, there is one big difference,
crv in town is basically an electric car, which power source is petrol engine, while battery is only covering short periods or slow acceleration/cruising. That has major influence on smoothness of the ride. The delayed petrol help for power is a minus, same as it sometime noticeable noise, but on other side, you never charge that thing with a cable.

and for those who admire plug-in hybrid, you need to remember,
-on electric only, their acceleration usually is only "fine",
-to compensate initial extra cost it will need 4-8 years, by that time relatively small battery will be safely over 2000+ charging cycles. meaning its capacity degrade noticeably if not end of life.
-unless car has option to precondition(heat/cool cabin AND engine) while plugged, it will be running petrol at winter even if EV is selected, or your prefer it in freezing cold in cabin ? small battery wont allow electric heating even with heatpump.

 

[Danl49]

@ Ding_0P: As the owner of a Kia Niro PHEV, I find most of your observations about the PHEV to be accurate. The sweet spot for the PHEV is if your daily driving is such that it allows you to operate on electric only. Many Niro PHEV owners find that they can drive the vast majority of their miles on electric - as long as they don't need to heat the cabin or defog the windows -- and get upwards 100-150 miles / gal in temperate weather. If your driving pattern falls within the PHEV range, you generally still have to be a pretty high mile driver and keep the car a long time to pay back the extra cost of the PHEV. The Kia Niro is somewhat of an exception to that in that with the $4,500 Fed Tax Credit, it only cost a few hundred more than a similarly equipped Niro Hybrid. Also, due to the need to plug in regularly, PHEV owners need to have easy access to an outlet. This eliminates many renters / those who need to park on the street.

For a person with the right driving patterns, a RAV-4 Prime could be a great car depending on their driving needs and the additional premium for the PHEV features. I know that for my needs, a PHEV SUV does not make sense.