[thomasbg]

Almost to the day the battery died on the 2018 after two years. No previous problems with the battery, in fact up till this morning car cranked just as it had since day one. It then struggled a bit in the afternoon when starting and by the time we got back in the car after 30 mins of driving it was dead.

AAA and dealer both said it had a bad cell and replaced it under warranty (the dealer). They did say the new battery is a new design for what it's worth.

What's annoying is with all this driving sense technology Honda crammed into the car, they didn't bother to give us a way to check the battery charge level or pop something up telling you it's not charging properly. The fact that Honda hack folks can get the data to show up on the car makes this even that much more aggravating.

The only strange behavior lately was the head unit behaving very sluggishly - more so than normal even after reboots - and the GPS would get confused either thinking we were a few streets to the left/right or would just spin around for a bit - all during clear sky days. Coincidence perhaps but if you're seeing something similar might be worth it to head to a shop and have them check your charge level.

 

[BoostedV]

Almost to the day the battery died on the 2018 after two years. No previous problems with the battery, in fact up till this morning car cranked just as it had since day one. It then struggled a bit in the afternoon when starting and by the time we got back in the car after 30 mins of driving it was dead.

AAA and dealer both said it had a bad cell and replaced it under warranty (the dealer). They did say the new battery is a new design for what it's worth.

What's annoying is with all this driving sense technology Honda crammed into the car, they didn't bother to give us a way to check the battery charge level or pop something up telling you it's not charging properly. The fact that Honda hack folks can get the data to show up on the car makes this even that much more aggravating.

The only strange behavior lately was the head unit behaving very sluggishly - more so than normal even after reboots - and the GPS would get confused either thinking we were a few streets to the left/right or would just spin around for a bit - all during clear sky days. Coincidence perhaps but if you're seeing something similar might be worth it to head to a shop and have them check your charge level.

your battery gets checked every oil change at honda and you can yest it yourself. Some batteries just sat longer at a dealer or get run/used differently.

 

[ondarvr]

Bad batteries are common in Hondas, and they can create all kinds of strange electrical problems.

 

[williamsji]

Bad batteries are common in Hondas, and they can create all kinds of strange electrical problems.

Bad batteries are actually common across the industry, not just Hondas.

 

[williamsji]

Almost to the day the battery died on the 2018 after two years. No previous problems with the battery, in fact up till this morning car cranked just as it had since day one. It then struggled a bit in the afternoon when starting and by the time we got back in the car after 30 mins of driving it was dead.

AAA and dealer both said it had a bad cell and replaced it under warranty (the dealer). They did say the new battery is a new design for what it's worth.

What's annoying is with all this driving sense technology Honda crammed into the car, they didn't bother to give us a way to check the battery charge level or pop something up telling you it's not charging properly. The fact that Honda hack folks can get the data to show up on the car makes this even that much more aggravating.

The only strange behavior lately was the head unit behaving very sluggishly - more so than normal even after reboots - and the GPS would get confused either thinking we were a few streets to the left/right or would just spin around for a bit - all during clear sky days. Coincidence perhaps but if you're seeing something similar might be worth it to head to a shop and have them check your charge level.

I have both a battery monitor connected to my battery, with a bluetooth app on my phone that gives me an on demand readout on my battery. It also keeps a 30 day log, on one minute intervals, of the battery voltage and downloads any new data when I connect my phone app with the monitor. You can also set the monitor to send you an alert if the battery voltage ever drops below a set point of your choosing.

I also have a little digital voltage readout plugged in to my front center console 12vdc socket.. so I can always see what my battery and charging system are doing while driving. This allows me to easily keep track of when the charging system begins to down throttle to a low charge state of 12.5V which means the charging system has detected that the battery is fully recharged (via a current sensor on the ground side of the battery). Note: The 12v socket is powered down when you turn off the vehicle, so you cannot monitor your battery when the CRV is off.

If your battery cell caps (those two square pop-off caps) have never been removed and you have never checked your electrolyte levels, it is likely that your bad cell died due to low fluid, or perhaps early sulfation of the plate due to low battery charge. Then again, plates being mechanical and a bit fragile.. a really bad speedbump could in some cases tip a cell plate into failure as well.

Batteries are literally the least reliable component in modern motor vehicles.

 

[TheDarkKnight]

A bad battery is far better to be an "issue" than something deep within the engine or drivetrain.

Its a consumable part that has a finite life.

 

[sirwired]

Bad batteries are common in Hondas, and they can create all kinds of strange electrical problems.

The entire US auto manufacturing industry sources batteries from the same two or three suppliers. There really isn't anything "Honda" about the battery other than the sticker on the top. Yes, they are responsible for it, but the generic batteries Honda buys aren't any better or worse than anybody else's.

 

[ondarvr]

The entire US auto manufacturing industry sources batteries from the same two or three suppliers. There really isn't anything "Honda" about the battery other than the sticker on the top. Yes, they are responsible for it, but the generic batteries Honda buys aren't any better or worse than anybody else's.

Just because a battery is made in the same plant doesn’t mean they are of the same quality.

But, beyond that......

Choosing the wrong size battery is the problem.

The stock batteries have been too small for a very long time. As the demand on the battery increases with advanced technology it exceeds what the stock battery can do.

Battery quality can be trumped by installing a battery that’s too small to do the required job.

 

[williamsji]

Just because a battery is made in the same plant doesn’t mean they are of the same quality.

But, beyond that......

Choosing the wrong size battery is the problem.

The stock batteries have been too small for a very long time. As the demand on the battery increases with advanced technology it exceeds what the stock battery can do.

Battery quality can be trumped by installing a battery that’s too small to do the required job.

^^Largely a myth being presented here.

As for battery production, the handful of remaining suppliers in North America basically provide identical batteries (for any given size) in terms of specs, warranties, etc. Some do sell a premium version of their batteries, which essentially have a more complex and expensive plate design that can mitigate early plate defects. In reality, it is the plates that are the weak point in batteries, and batteries are the least reliable component in the modern motor vehicle.

As for the benefits of putting a larger battery in, they are small really.

The difference in actual reserve storage capacity and CCA from the largest battery generally offered for consumer motor vehicles and the smallest is only about 25%. In other words, putting a larger battery in (like an H24, or H5) to replace a 51R is NOT going to give you the peace of mind you seek. The increase in reserve capacity will give you at most an extra week of your vehicle sitting idle on it's normal parasitic of 35-50ma. And where CCA is concerned, these smaller engines do NOT require more than 500 CCA, even in cold weather conditions. Feel free to put a larger battery in, but it is largely a waste of time and money. In some cases, like very cold weather conditions, an AGM battery may be a better choice than a flooded cell battery.

What is helpful in these modern vehicles is to actually respect and maintain and monitor the condition of your battery. Flooded cell batteries are NOT maintenance free. They need their electrolyte checked and topped up with distilled water at least once a year, twice a year is better, and you do need to put a smart charger on the battery every now and then to let it get a good healthy saturation charge. Also, every few months, put them on a battery tester to check the integrity of the battery. And never let your battery stay below a 12.3 vdc charge for prolonged periods of time, as the plates begin to sulfate at an accelerated rate.

 

[ondarvr]

I will need to tell a close relative that works at a battery manufacturing plant that the different specs and build designs are a myth. He must be misunderstanding his job and the components going into different brands. Glad we cleared that up.

Yes the larger battery helps, sometimes it makes the difference between these nagging dead battery incidents and no problems at all.

A larger deep cycle battery would probably be a better option. It would have no problem producing the CCAs required to start it, and would last longer under a light draw.

 

[williamsji]

I will need to tell a close relative that works at a battery manufacturing plant that the different specs and build designs are a myth. He must be misunderstanding his job and the components going into different brands. Glad we cleared that up.

Yes the larger battery helps, sometimes it makes the difference between these nagging dead battery incidents and no problems at all.

A larger deep cycle battery would probably be a better option. It would have no problem producing the CCAs required to start it, and would last longer under a light draw.

Not advised use a deep cycle battery in a motor vehicle.

 

[SVTfocusO3]

planned obsolescence - Google Search

 

[ondarvr]

Not advised use a deep cycle battery in a motor vehicle.

Please explain in detail, I fully understand the difference between the two types, so do go into great detail.

 

[Mike728]

Please explain in detail, I fully understand the difference between the two types, so do go into great detail.

I have no dog in this show, but a quick Google search shows some of the reasons it is not advised. Can I use a deep cycle battery in a car? - Quora

 

[ondarvr]

I have no dog in this show, but a quick Google search shows some of the reasons it is not advised. Can I use a deep cycle battery in a car? - Quora

Not much in that link either way.

 

[williamsji]

Please explain in detail, I fully understand the difference between the two types, so do go into great detail.

After your snarky reply to my earlier post.. no.. do your own leg work on the internet. I'm not going to provide details to someone who simply wants to troll any such reply. Better yet, get your "alleged" buddy working in battery manufacture to mansplain it to you.

There is plenty of guidance out there on the pitfalls of putting a deep cycle marine battery in an motor vehicle. Seek it out, or don't... I really do not care one way or the other.

 

[Mike728]

Not much in that link either way.

Really?

"Deep cycles are designed to deliver a small number of amperes for long periods of time. They are not ordinarily designed to deliver high starting current which can be several hundred amperes."

 

[ondarvr]

If you understand the sizing, Like explained in another post there, it gets clearer.

Deep cycle batteries are much larger and more expensive compared to starting batteries with equal CCAs.

So to keep cost, size and weight down, motor vehicles go with batteries designed to deliver high CCAs for their size. And for many decades this was fine, you had a big V8 that used little to no power when the vehicle was off, and they used powerful charging systems to recharge it quickly.

Now we have small motors that don't require high CCAs to start, so they put small batteries in them. Then add in the dual charging system Honda uses that barely maintains the minimum voltage the battery requires.

They do this to save money and minimully increase MPG.

But, now we have electronics that put a continuous draw on the battery when the car is on or off, then cycle certain diagnostic programs on and off when the cars not in use.

Now we end up with dead, or short lived batteries, gee, I wonder why.

To correctly size a deep cycle battery you would need to go physically larger (as I said in my original post).

This gives you greater CCAs and reserve capacity.

Look at the Deep cycle battery and check the CCAs, they tell you right upfront what it can do as a starting battery.

 

[ondarvr]

If someone is uncomfortable with using a deep cycle battery of the correct size, then go for a dual purpose battery rated for both applications.

It will still be larger and more expensive, but not as much as the correct sized deep cycle.

 

[hans471+]

Cars use batteries that are a compromise but mostly designed for quick high amperage. They use thin plates that can quickly absorb acid which gives them the ability to produce large surges of power for cranking an engine, thus the name of "Cranking battery". These thin plates also allow the battery to quickly recharge . Deep cycle batteries are designed for long slow draws like on a trolling motor on a boat. To do that they have thicker plates that can slowly absorb acid and produce less peak current but for a longer time. This design also favors a long slow recharge. Also, during any charge cycle, especially a deep discharge, some lead will flake off the plates. Deep discharging increases this tendancy. So, deep cycle batteris also have a larger open reservoir area in the bottom for these flakes to fall and not touch the active plates and short out. Automotive electrical systems are designed so that the primary source of power while running is the generator. The battery serves three purposes: to store power to feed the starter motor; to provide additional power if the short term needs of the vehicle exceed the output of the generator (think idling at night with the heater on high, lights on, rear window defroster, etc). and to stabilize the voltage in the system while the generator is working, helping to smooth out surges and flatten out the variations in the generator output. Put an oscilloscope on the output wire of a generator and watch what is going on in that circuit. Without the battery to filter it is not smooth, more of a ripple due to the reification of the three sine waves inside of the generator).
There are many factors which determine the useful lifespan of a battery. Avoiding deep cycling helps. Keeping the electrolyte at the proper level is very helpful. Avoiding high heat aids its life. But in the end some of it is just luck. I have had many Honda OEM batteries last six years of more. Some of that is due to environmental factors, our cars stay in a very stable temperature garage. I keep tabs on the electrolyte level and keep the top and case of the battery free of acid. (Acid does get on a battery and as it is a conductor it increases the rate of self discharge thus running the battery down.

There are many considerations in picking the right battery for a vehicle but putting a "deep cycle" battery in an automobile is just not the best choice.That is not to say it won't work, but it just isn't engineered to perform at its best in that environment.