Honda CR-V Owners Club Forums banner

1 - 20 of 38 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
220 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hello everyone,

Can anyone support my theory about the 12 points vs 6 points ratchets and socket tools???

Before when i did not much about tools i just bought tools without knowing differences betwen 12 vs 6 points

later i found out that using 6 points is better specially for honda, toyotas, etc. (cars that i have and had in the past)

6 points contacts since the bolts are basically 6 treads. Regardless of metric or standar but to use 6 points

Does everybody does a conversion between metrics and standards to get a closer grip on the bolts??

Capture12.jpg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,170 Posts
I agree with you. 6 Points are most of the time better than 12 points the only time I would use 12 points is where the heads of the fastener is 12 points & in a tight spots where you can only use 12 points. Very nice chart you have there! Especially if the fastener is very tight 6 points is the only way to go, to prevent damaging the head. This is also the reason why I always buy both metric & Imperial measurements as sometimes the bolt is so tight I will try both metric & imperial which one has less play then use either Imperial on a bolt that is very tight. A good example on lug nuts usually they are 19mm head but if they are stuck or super tight I will grab the 3/4 it will fit with less gap in between the points & it will loosen out without damaging the head. If worst comes to worst you can hammer in the next tightest socket there just to take it out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12 Posts
My experience with 12 points is that they may work well with sizes greater than 1/2 inch.
A 12 point socket on anything smaller and stubborn will end poorly - rounding off the bolt or nut.
So I like most prefer the 6 point sockets any day.

I did not know there was a third unit of measure when it came to nuts and bolts. SAE and Metric is all I've seen.
But I know that our Canadian friends buy gasoline (petrol) by the imperial gallon. So I thank otto888man for the discussion about Imperial measurement. :)

I guess I'll have to google to see what vehicles use Imperial fasteners.

Cheers!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
560 Posts
12 point are the way to go if the bolts are not rusty or too tight. the 12 points are quicker and when space is limited. Not saying 6 point are no good, they will save you when bolts are rusty and a bit rounded off. In Canada gas is sold by the litre
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,053 Posts
Me neither...

My experience with 12 points is that they may work well with sizes greater than 1/2 inch.
A 12 point socket on anything smaller and stubborn will end poorly - rounding off the bolt or nut.

I did not know there was a third unit of measure when it came to nuts and bolts. SAE and Metric is all I've seen.Cheers!
I have only been twisting wrenches since the old Triumph Tiger Cub of the '50's. They, and all British I have known of until they had the good sense to go Metric, were Whitworth.

Started with 12- point Craftsman tools and never rounded off a bolt head. I did break the tip off a #3 Phillips with a pipe wrench trying to help a friend open the cases on a Harley 125. - the tip broke off. Told Sears guy how I did it and he handed me a new one - no charge. We were kids and knew nothing of an impact screw driver yet.

Anyway, Whitworth, Metric, and SAE are all I ever heard of.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Each have their place. Majority of time 6 pt. is used but when in a tight spot with minimal clearance a 12 pt. can save the day.

As ottoman suggested, if I have a fastener that feels a bit loose, I will try the opposite standard to see if there is a better fit.

I think the Chinese developed their own standard on some fasteners.:rolleyes:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
220 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Thanks everyone for their inputs.

I love more the 6 points, but in tight spots i agree to use 12 points. I AGREE

someone said that is its common sense and should be no debate,

EXCUSE ME, Maybe you know it, but not everyone has the same knowledge, I am just trying to see if we all have the same idea about it
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
75 Posts
Unless you are working in aviation or another field where you actually encounter 12-point bolts, there is no reason to use 12-point sockets.

6-point sockets are less likely to strip the bolt, and with today's high tooth count ratchets (72, 80, 90, even 120 teeth), the swing arcs are so small that you'll never need a 12 point socket.

12-point box ends are good on non-ratcheting wrenches because they cut down the swing arc from 60 to 30 degrees. However, with a 72 tooth ratchet, the swing arc is already a very low 5 degrees.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,170 Posts
My experience with 12 points is that they may work well with sizes greater than 1/2 inch.
A 12 point socket on anything smaller and stubborn will end poorly - rounding off the bolt or nut.
So I like most prefer the 6 point sockets any day.

I did not know there was a third unit of measure when it came to nuts and bolts. SAE and Metric is all I've seen.
But I know that our Canadian friends buy gasoline (petrol) by the imperial gallon. So I thank otto888man for the discussion about Imperial measurement. :)

I guess I'll have to google to see what vehicles use Imperial fasteners.

Cheers!
I have seen some 90's Chrysler vehicles still use Imperial size fasteners. In Canada they use to use Imperial Gallon to purchase gasoline. Not anymore.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,592 Posts
6 pt vs. 12 pt . . . . . Look at it this way, they are two different set of wenches, and sometimes another choice can be the solution to the issue. It has worked for me!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
252 Posts
Today's ratchets seem to have more resolution than older ones (I think mine are 100 tooth), so I try to use 6 point sockets on anything suspected to be stubborn in order to apply the most torque and prevent rounding of bolt heads. The 100 tooth ratchet provides ample flexibility in tight spots. Wrenches obviously are fixed position, but I have accumulated a set of both 6 and 12 point over time (can't help myself when tools are on sale).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
220 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Today's ratchets seem to have more resolution than older ones (I think mine are 100 tooth), so I try to use 6 point sockets on anything suspected to be stubborn in order to apply the most torque and prevent rounding of bolt heads. The 100 tooth ratchet provides ample flexibility in tight spots. Wrenches obviously are fixed position, but I have accumulated a set of both 6 and 12 point over time (can't help myself when tools are on sale).
Dont over carry yourself buying more than what you need!

Yeah, i asked this because my air filter screws i think i screwed them up with a 12 points and had a big problem to remove them
so, i will keep all this in mind
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,592 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
75 Posts
You can never have too many tools !!! :cool:
Too true. In 3/8" drive, I have 4 sets of sockets from 8-19mm. Shallow 6 point, shallow 12 point, deep 6 point, deep 12 point :D. And that's just 3/8" drive!


Speaking of 6pt vs 12pt, how about 3pt? Saw the new Craftsman Extreme Sockets on tv and they look pretty cool - 5 sockets that cover both sae and metric as well as virtually rounded off and abused bolts...

View attachment 54106
Those are a complete gimmick, just like all the other tools which claim to cover both SAE and metric in the same socket. Universal sockets = loose fit on everything.

The only exception to the above is Metrinch's 12-point sockets, which have a unique design that uses 6 of the 12 points for SAE and the other 6 for metric. That means they don't compromise on fit like all the other "universal" designs. They're also USA-made, which is very much a rarity these days. Those would be the only sockets I'd use if I was looking at a universal SAE/Metric set.

http://www.amazon.com/Original-Metrinch-Drive-Point-Socket/dp/B00XM9VX52/ref=sr_1_6?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1448506625&sr=1-6&keywords=metrinch+socket

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
229 Posts
Those are a complete gimmick, just like all the other tools which claim to cover both SAE and metric in the same socket. Universal sockets = loose fit on everything.

The only exception to the above is Metrinch's 12-point sockets, which have a unique design that uses 6 of the 12 points for SAE and the other 6 for metric. That means they don't compromise on fit like all the other "universal" designs. They're also USA-made, which is very much a rarity these days. Those would be the only sockets I'd use if I was looking at a universal SAE/Metric set.

I don't know, that looks pretty gimmicky to me. Just like, as you say, all the others.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
75 Posts
I don't know, that looks pretty gimmicky to me. Just like, as you say, all the others.
What's gimmicky about them?

All the other "universal" sockets are purposely made with looser tolerances in order to fit 6 point, 12 point, E-torx, and other fastener types in the same socket.

These have 12 points, but 6 points are machined for SAE and 6 are machined for metric. That means they're not compromised with looser tolerances to fit multiple fastener types. Also, they're only designed to fit SAE and metric, not E-torx or damaged fasteners. They should perform no differently than a set of 12 point sockets in either SAE or metric.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
229 Posts
How are they not a gimmick?

Sorry, I'd rather use a 10mm 6pt socket on a 10mm nut/bolt and a 3/8" socket on a 3/8". I don't need an 11/16" and/or 17mm socket for my drain plug, I'll just grab the 17mm socket and be good.

And, I just like going and buying a new socket/wrench when I need one. My tool box is getting crowded though, Santa might need to bring me a bigger one for Christmas next year. Especially if he brings me a nice set of ratcheting wrenches this year.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
75 Posts
How are they not a gimmick?

Sorry, I'd rather use a 10mm 6pt socket on a 10mm nut/bolt and a 3/8" socket on a 3/8". I don't need an 11/16" and/or 17mm socket for my drain plug, I'll just grab the 17mm socket and be good.

And, I just like going and buying a new socket/wrench when I need one. My tool box is getting crowded though, Santa might need to bring me a bigger one for Christmas next year. Especially if he brings me a nice set of ratcheting wrenches this year.
I think you're misunderstanding the design of the sockets I posted.

In my opinion, they're not a gimmick because they're no different from a normal 12 point socket in terms of fit. They have 6 points machined for metric and another 6 points specifically machined for SAE, unlike all the other universal designs which go for looser overall tolerances. So, a 10mm + 3/8" Metrinch socket would perform the same as a normal 12-point 10mm socket, and it would also be able to work as a 3/8" socket that has the same fit as a 12-point 3/8" socket.

And as you probably already realize, those sockets I posted above are not designed to be your primary socket set. I agree with you that having separate sets of 6 and 12 point sockets is the best, and that's exactly the setup I have in my toolbox, However, the Metrinch sockets would definitely save space in a mobile toolkit, and they would do so without compromising on tolerances.
 
1 - 20 of 38 Posts
Top