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The. Admin. Istrator.
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Given the plans by the PRC Govt to create more coal powered energy etc, this strategy does seem a bit farcical - and Honda is not the only OEM playing this game either.

But will the tree-huggers see the irony....
This is what happens when politics and marketing trump Engineering.
I agree, it's supremely ironic that these vehicles will be powered by coal-derived electricity.
It has nothing to do with saving the planet and everything to do with trying to appear to be doing so.
But Honda has to play ball with the PRC if they want to sell cars there.
 

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The. Admin. Istrator.
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But Honda has to play ball with the PRC if they want to sell cars there.
The sooner the world sticks two fingers up to the regime there, the quicker the world can move away from ANY sort of reliance on them.
 
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View attachment 151016

Given the plans by the PRC Govt to create more coal powered energy etc, this strategy does seem a bit farcical - and Honda is not the only OEM playing this game either.

But will the tree-huggers see the irony....
China is so often misunderstood when viewed from the outside.

China has a short term power crisis in play, which is driving the media narrative here about China doubling down on coal. This is largely due to continued economic expansion and continued growth of consumer power use in the home.

EVs on the other hand represent a long term crisis of planning and infrastructure (for all nations). And the thing with China is.. when they decide to go in a particular direction, they are extremely good at mobilizing planning, funding, and infrastructure.

China is not building new coal fired power plants, and hasn't for years now. They have modernized/expanded existing plants in select provinces. They are also rapidly deprecating coal as a source of heating fuel as well. But they do still have a lot of coal powered power generation still in commission, so the power crisis right now simply means they delay their phase out of coal by a few years. They are rapidly shifting investments into green energy sources like solar, wind, and hydro (all of which they have in abundance). Projections indicate China will be near a 50/50 mix of fossil/renewables by 2040, which is remarkable considering China will also see year over year growth of between 5 nd 10% each year in their economy and consumer spending.

China in the short term will ramp up coal production for short term demands, and is raising the price of power (a first in China that I am aware of, and a very capitalistic approach to consumer modulation) to motivate consumers to conserve electricity. Long term, they probably will be well ahead of the US in moving from fossil fuel dependence to green renewable energy dependence.
 

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Honda has made it clear for years that China is their "lead-in" market for new vehicle innovation and production release.

One of the reasons Honda put priority on China for it's move to EV are three fold:

1) China has embraced EVs as policy and as a key requirement to move off of fossil fuels in the long term. They clearly understand that this means modernization of their entire power grid and power sources over the next 20 years. Long thinkers and planners, the Chinese.

2) China actually detests coal and wants it out of it's supply chain and deprecated to export to 3rd world countries at an accelerated pace. But it is the power source they entered the modern era with, and it won't go away quickly. Coal nearly destroyed the City of Bejing in the first decade of the 21st century, and being the capital and seat of power.. Bejing collapsing under extreme coal air pollution was a blessing in disguise for Chinese as it forced the government to take action for the long term to reduce and eventually remove coal from power or heat generation uses. Hence, the first phase is China buying up oil reserves and influence and control over oil reserves as oil will be the nations bridge from coal to renewable energy sources.

3) China is a successful market segment for Honda with the largest single growth potential in the motor vehicle industry. Keep in mind, 20 years ago almost no consumers actually owned and drove motor vehicles. They relied on public transportation and taxi services for most transportation needs. And as demand for motor vehicles continues to grow in China, Honda is well positioned to grow in the market accordingly. And make no mistake, young consumers in China are pretty much like young consumers in the rest of the world.. they want techy, new, flashy, and modern.. and EVs fit that bill nicely. As long as the financial system in China can support the borrowing by consumers to buy vehicles.. vehicle sales will continue to grow in China.

True story: 20 years ago.. virtually ALL taxis in major urban cities in China ran on Propane and were manufactured by VW. China has been on the clean fuel path before. And there are major research in China today to provide other fuel options that solve the pollution issues. The Chinese seem very interested in a return to Propane or similar, as well as Methanol as a primary source of clean fuel for ICE use.

As the largest growth market in the world for motor vehicles, China as a consumer society now days will have a large say in whether EVs or hybrids dominate in the move away from pure ICE. From my years in China, I predict it will be EV in large urban cities and hybrid in rural areas of China. Time will tell.
 

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Have heard China will build more nuclear power plants. But, not your standard designs made for Uranium 235 and Plutonium 239. They plan to use Thorium which is much more efficient and produces less waste product. The Molten Salt Nuclear plants are suppose to be able to use the present waste produced by standard nuclear power plant as fuel as well. The new nuclear power plants are suppose to be walk away safe.
 

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Now that, I did not know! :eek:
It was great for the air quality, given how many taxis were in circulation in the era before many consumers actually owned motor vehicles. The VWs were some version of a Jetta class... with different names for the Chinese market.

The downside is the propane tanks were always in the trunk and took up about 30% of the trunk space, so it was very common to have to shoe horn bags into the trunk and the passenger front seat leaving room for only 2 or 3 passengers in the rear seat. If you have bags and more than 3 people.. you had to wrangle two taxis for a journey.

And seat belts... nope... But I only ever saw one accident in Shanghai that involved a taxi, and I found the drivers to be very safe in an otherwise very chaotic driving environment.
 

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... very interesting points that were not known to me (bounded rationality) lol. Still, until we (the US, UK, China etc) have some hydrogen electric power plants or some other serious power movers, it will be coal for quite some time. Nuclear creates too much waste that has to be stored. Wind, solar, and hydroelectric simple do not create enough power without destroying aviarian and other habitats. This being said, once hydrogen power plants come online, this will change the game.


So too, electric vehicles are limited in range, so hydrogen will still be the ultimate future in fuel.
 
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