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Discussion Starter #1
hi experts,
i am new to this forum
just confusing to decide oil grade for My own CRV

i am located at toronto/canada
i just bought Honda CRV - 2005 EX
as per Honda manual they suggest OWN oil (5W-20)
is this Semi synthetic??
at honda delar cost me oil change $55

I have good technical knowledge( not expert)
so i decide to follow DIY

i bought castrol 5W-20 which cost me in canada $16 (canadian Tire)
this is regular oil not synthetic

my request to you experts is synthetic and non synthetic makes
lot different?? where grade 5W-20 is same??
can i use this castrol regular(non synthetic) 5w-20 with CRV-2005 EX ???
next oil change could be 4000Km OR 8000Km with this Oil ??
is it OK to use same oil in winter and summer ??

your help appreciated
thanks in advance
 

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I,ve used PENZOIL fully synthetic 5W - 20 per advise
of my Japanese car mechanic. I have '07 CR-V AWD.
 

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Fossil vs synthetic oil

That is correct. Honda's 5W20 is fossil oil. Honda might make a synthetic but I would think it would be clearly labeled and with a price to match.

I will be using Mobil1 when I change the oil this Spring or Summer since Mobil wrote the book on marketable synthetic during the Alaska pipeline days. The pipeline equipment kept failing due to the cold temperatures. Mobil developed their synthetic oil to solve the problem. Other manufacturer's products may or may not be equal as some are not true synthetics but are near synthetics derived from Fossil oil. I have read Castrol is one of these near synthetics. Mobil reportedly sued Castrol for misleading the consumer by labeling fossil derived synthetics as Syntech. Not a true derived in the lab synthetic produced at a lower cost.

Living in Canada if the temperatures drop below about -10F you can benefit from the synthetic's lower pour point of -35F to -45F. Most Fossil oil has a pour point of -20F approximately. That means that it cannot get to lubricates all areas when starting a cold engine that has cold soaked overnight to say -30F.

No one seems to be too outwardly concerned about this on this forum while it is a no brainer the way I see it living in NH or in any area where temperatures drop below -10F. BTW the Hot characteristics are better too. Most synthetic requires less VI additives so the rated weight remains true longer than with Fossil oil. I.E. a 5W20 will remain a 5W20 longer while the fossil oil might become conservatively a 5W10 after 8k miles. I have read in articles by those much more qualified than I that in as low as 3K miles the viscosity can change in some dyno or Fossil oils from 10w40 to 10w20 and even 5w15. As the additives break down. That is one reason Honda and other's have switched to engines designed to run with with less of a viscosity span. Or from 5w30 to 5w20.

I used to run Castrol's 5w50 synthetic instead of the manufacturer specified oil viscosity in Toyota's not knowing of this effect. I never had a problem but it might have caused additional wear. I think 10w40 was specified above 90F. So if the oil became 10w25 it would not adequately protect being too thin.

In addition being synthesized it has less sulfur than Fossil oils. In the combustion process the sulfur turns into sulfuric acid which can do a lot of harm after the additive package ingredient responsible for absorbing the sulfur is used up.

-Rg
 

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While I don't myself have evidence to back this up, I've never liked Castrol lubricants in general (I've always used Pennzoil, Valvoline or Quaker State, in that order of preference)

Also, while this was a while ago, Castrol was the only brand tested by Consumer Reports not to meet their SAE requirements as printed on their label (that was 20 years ago though).
 

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Castrol oil is OEM supplied in all new BMW's, and has been the preferred oil of European luxury sport sedan manufacturers for decades. I wouldn't dream of putting Pennzoil in my 325 or my CR-V. Perhaps if I owned a Silverado...
 

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If you want a "true synthetic" then you have 3 choices. Amsoil, RP or Redline. The rest so called synthetics are not 100% synthetic.
 

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Use any name-brand 5W20, mineral or synthetic, and change it and the filter when you should. In the north, where warm-ups take longer, or if you do a lot of under 10 mile trips, follow the "severe" maintenance schedule in the owner's manual. The CR-V has a well-engineered engine that is not highly stressed (unlike the S2000 sportscar) and probably won't benefit from the use of synthetic oil. However, the driver might, if it makes him/her feel better. ;)

pete
 

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If you want a "true synthetic" then you have 3 choices. Amsoil, RP or Redline. The rest so called synthetics are not 100% synthetic.
Even Mobil 1!?! Even Royal Purple !?!

I use Full syn. Mobil 1 5w20 and K&N oil filters year round.

You can use regular or full syn. in your 2005. Or a mix even. Just stay with 5w20 weight. This is one fluid you don't have to buy a bottle with a Honda logo on it. Any 5w20 will work.

I recommend the best oil filter you can afford.

Some recommend 3,000 mile oil changes, others 7,000 mile oil changes. You pick. I side with Exxon and do it about 3000-3500 miles.
 

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Agreed...for 99.9% of the people, if you change your oil and filter every 3-5K miles, you wont see a major difference with using a synthetic, as long as the oil is high quality and has the proper additives.

However, in high performance engines, or engines used in extreme conditions (under -10F), or you want a very long (more than 10K miles) oil change interval then the unique properties of a synthetic will really make themselves known.

On a commercial diesel (two stroke super charged), a synthetic is really the only way to go IMHO, unless you want to change the oil once a month, since you can rack up 5K miles in a week.
 

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Some recommend 3,000 mile oil changes, others 7,000 mile oil changes. You pick. I side with Exxon and do it about 3000-3500 miles.
Why do so many want to over do the changes?

ExxonMobil might recommend 3500 miles because they sell oil but they also in the same sentence say to follow the manufacturers recommendations.

ExxonMobil has changed the intervals lately. At one point they used to claim up to 25,000 miles but must have gotten sued as clearly you cannot do that in all engines under all circumstances.

Currently Mobil sells a 'Mobil Clean 7500' mile oil. It says so right on the container in big letters.

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_Clean_7500.aspx

You are not going to tell me that you will still change every 3500 miles using this 7500 mile OIL?

This wasted use of our resources is partly due for our dependence on Middle East and Venezuelan oil. We need to wake up and stop thinking like we did in the 70'-80's. That 3500 mile changes kept your engines clean and that oil was the life of the engine. It can do the same function with minimal impact on engine life (if any compared with 3500 miles) by changing it at 7500 miles in most situations.

Currently Honda apparently thinks that the fossil oils can go much further than 7500 as indicated by the MMI. Out to 12,000 and beyond miles in mostly highway and long distance trips where the highway is not a parking lot.

Why do some of you fight it so strongly and stick with the 3000-3500 interval?

Ya, ya. I know you never had any problems before doing that.
Did you ever consider the fact that you could say the same thing changing it every 7,500 miles?

-Rg
 

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Mobil 1 isn't synthetic....hummmmmmm?
No, Mobil 1 synthetic is classified as group III. Group III oil products are mineral based and therefore are semi sythetics even if most of the final product is synthesized. Only true synthetics (group IV) are 100% synthetics.

On another forum I belong to a member who retired from the petroleum industry said only in America are group III's allowed to be sold as "synthetics" I don't know this for a fact.
 

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Mobil 1 isn't synthetic....hummmmmmm?
You should be skeptic!
Bah, Humbug? Where is there current proof of this?
That Mobil1 is not PAO Class IV oil.

The bit about the carrier oil for the additives not being synthetic in Mobil1 is old news and all blown out of proportion. First of all the additive package amount to from 5% to about 10%. But only a small percentage of the additive is the carrier. I'm not sure what that number is but when all is said and done the total percentage on fossil derived Class III carrier might only be .5% to 1%.

Does any one really truly think that the performance is going to vary significantly if the the oil is 99% PAO with a 1% class III carrier?

In any event that is old news. Currently Mobil claims that the carrier is 100% synthetic too!

Bah Humbug!

-Rg
 

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No, Mobil 1 synthetic is classified as group III. Group III oil products are mineral based and therefore are semi sythetics even if most of the final product is synthesized. Only true synthetics (group IV) are 100% synthetics.
You cannot believe everything that you read! This is an urban legend!
Someone is trying to slander ExxonMobil without knowing all the facts be it on purpose or not.

I have already explained the carrier in the additives bit.
And how that is old history and it currently is no longer a Class III carrier but a full Synthetic carrier.

And even if it was Class III it does not make any significant difference to have 1% Class III and the remaining 99% PAO Class IV! (actual % unknown but this small ratio is just used for the sake of argument. In reality it is a percentage of 5% to 10%. Say 50%x5% would be 2.5%. actual ratio of carrier is unknown or 50% in this example.)

-Rg

(ediy: updated Class IV vs class V mixup.)
 

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Yes you can use Castrol GTX 5w20 conventional oil.

IMHO, you may benefit from synthetic oil in cold weather performace (less than -20F or abouts), or if you're looking for extended drain intervals.

The length of your drain interval may be best approximated by used oil analysis, but I presume in most applications, 5k miles would be a nice conservative choice.
 

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There are 3 things that I will never discuss on this forum:1) Religion 2) Politics 3) Motor Oil
Good point. I guess I like to beat myself up and my head against the wall. No matter how much proof I provide will it change the mind of some.

The length of your drain interval may be best approximated by used oil analysis, but I presume in most applications, 5k miles would be a nice conservative choice.
At least we are up to a 'CONSERVATIVE 5,000 miles' which is about 50% better than 3k-3,500 miles.

I do not have any problem with that under severe service even though with the exception of the extreme fringe service a 7500 miles interval will work too with minimal added wear and reduced longevity. Coincidentally I believe that is what Honda used to recommend in the maintenance charts prior to the MMI for severe service. It might be 7,000 miles, I forgot.

Anyhow Group IV oil is PAO and not group V as I erronuosly wrote before. That goes to show how well some of us have the correct facts. :rolleyes: DUH! It goes for moi too!

At this point I will take your advice MarkyMark and bug out. :D

-Rg

(edit: corrected Class V mixup)
 

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No, Mobil 1 synthetic is classified as group III. Group III oil products are mineral based and therefore are semi synthetics even if most of the final product is synthesized. Only true synthetics (group IV) are 100% synthetics.
I do not care if you talked to the POPE! What you write contains some misinformation showing inadequate knowledge of the topic somewhere along the line. Sorry MarkyMark but I have to clear the air. :D It smells like a dead animal. Once again I should probably take your advice! Oh well!

It depends on who you talk to as to what is a semi-synthetic. Technically as long as there is a synthetic type of performance, any oil can be labeled as a semi-synthetic. Currently Group III derived oils should be labeled semi-synthetic oils. Never a synthetic. But things beeing as they are I have to live with this terminology inaccuracy.

(edit: corrected Group terminology)

Contrary to what you wrote only a 100% PAO 'base' oil can be labeled a Group IV oil. This is by definition of a Group IV oil and has not been watered down by any voluntary manufacturer's terminology agreed acceptable by any court. This was before the label or terms were washed down mostly in Europe so that any Group III fossil oil meeting the basic requirements of a true Group IV PAO can be labeled as a 'true synthetic' or a 'near synthetic. Such was the decision of the courts as I know it. However all oils derived from fossil oil can at best be coined a Group III and more accurately are a semi-synthetic no matter what any court says. No mater how you slice it! Or how you change the terminology. I suppose we could rewrite history to meet Castrol's interests! :rolleyes: Give me a break!

Now back on track things change now and then but last I checked Mobil1 has 100% synthetic base and had a 100% synthetic additive carrier. I can only go by what Mobil claims as I do not have a lab in my back pocket. At least Mobil has not played the terminology game to try to make something look like what it is not. They are very up front posting the material data sheet on line.

http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENPVLMOMobil_1_Extended_Performance.asp

On the other hand Castrol Syntech was at one point a Group III base. When Mobil sued Castrol for using a similar and misleading term such as Syntech (I must confess I fell for it myself), Castrol countered by saying they never put the word Synthetic (on the older cans that had a Group III base...) What do they use now? Who knows!

I do not know or care what Castrol is using now but since they mislead me once for who knows how many years I will probably never buy their oil again. BTW I had some cam wear issues so I cannot write that 'I never had any problems' using Castrol Syntech. Due to the trust or sleazy factor, they lost it by using such a blatantly misleading technique and term such as 'Syntech'. Once trust is lost it is very difficult to get back.

As far as Castrol being the synthetic OEM oil used by all BMW's this again was not agreed upon by ExxonMobil. OOPs, apparently I am all wet. The list has changed and Mobil has lost the BMW factory fill contracts! :eek: Some BMW forums back up this claim that Mobil1 was once the factory fill. At one point select 5 and 7 series BMW models had factory fill of Mobil1. This seems not to be true anymore. Oh well! Suppliers changing with time is common and in no way does that mean one is better than the other.

It might be more accurate in any case that as a rule Castrol Synthetic is used by BMW dealers but that in no way shape or form means all BMW's ever come with Castrol Syntech from the factory. I can see how it might be falsely interpretted that way. I was told that was not the case only a few months ago by a BMW dealer when I inquired in person! Here is possibly a more accurate and up to date list of Mobil1 factory filled vehicles:

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Factory_Fill/Vehicles_Filled_Mobil_1.aspx

Here is another interesting article involving the factory fill use of Mobil1 by Honda:

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Files/Acura_RDX_Mobil_1_Brochure.pdf


-Rg
 
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