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Discussion Starter #1
Is "Honda Genuine Motor Oil" really just rebranded "Mobil Clean 5000?"

I've been reading up on oil at bobistheoilguy.com (a great site) and there are multiple articles saying that the "Honda Genuine" motor oil is just relabeled Mobil Clean 5000 which is conventional -- not synthetic blend. Has anyone else heard that? I know that the Honda stuff is an Exxon/Mobil product. But, I'm not sure which oil "model" it is.

If it is Mobil Clean 5000, then having the MM push it out to almost 9K between changes is interesting. I've got Mobil Clean 5000 in there now. If that's the same as Honda then how cool. No matter what, I'll send a sample out for analysis when I change it just to see how that comes out.
 

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barrys, I'm going to guess that you haven't been to "bob's" in a while?

In a nutshell, Exxon-Mobil (XOM) was Honda's supplier for its bottled oil products for years. Approximately eight or nine months ago, XOM lost its contract to ConocoPhillips (one word)(COP).

COP, as you may know, also happens to be the supplier of Ford Motor Company's bottled oil products under the brand name Motorcraft. If you return to bobistheoilguy.com and search the Virgin Oil Analyses, you will see that the analyses of Honda Genuine Motor Oil, both the synthetics and the semi-synthetics (Part#s 9036 and 9037), are virtually identical to their Ford Motorcraft counterparts.

(As an aside, Mobil Clean 5000 is now Mobil Super 5000. Alas, it's no longer as robust as the old MC5K.)
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for that nice detailed response.

Actually, I had just read the bobistheoilguy posts today, but those could have been old posts.

I had been reading more since I posted. Seems the older Honda oil -- perhaps the one in the silver bottle -- was an Exxon/Mobil oil and I think that was full conventional.

I since read what you just wrote which is that the new Honda oil (black bottle with "Synthetic Blend" on the label) is the same as Motorcraft Semisynthetic (which I use in my truck) and which is indeed supposed to be a very good oil.

Also good to hear about Mobil changing their MC5K. After reading all of this, I'll probably just start putting Motorcraft blend in since that's available cheaply all over the place.

But, I'd still like to know if the older Honda oil (silver bottle) -- supplied by Mobil -- was the same formulation as Mobil Clean 5000 or if it was a different Mobil oil.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
It seems like everyone was right at one point or another...
From the Bob... site:

It is all made by Conoco-Philips now. Even the 0w-20 ultimate full synthetic.

It isn't Kendall, it's regular Conoco stuff. The company I work for was taking the Conoco stickers off of the drums and putting Honda stickers on. Since the switch to SN/GF-5 it's the same.

It used to be Mobil for most of it, and Idemitsu I believe for the 0w-20.


That's consistent with:
* Used to be Mobil -- probably like MC5K.
* Switched to Conoco Philips blend recently -- same as Motorcraft.
* 0w20 (for 2010+) needs to be full synthetic and that seems consistent with crvee's post about the Apollo America GF5 product. Or maybe he's saying that it's all Apollo America now. Confusing that they'd switch to Conoco less than a year ago and then to Idemitsu so shortly after.

Interested in hearing other responses.
 

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I'm guessing that crvee is referring to what I'm going to call the "Insight/Hybrid" oil. That particular 0W-20 synthetic and only that synthetic (Honda sells two 0W-20s) is manufactured by Idemitsu. I don't know that part #. Everything else -- as in every other bottled motor oil product sold as Honda Genuine -- is COP.

(Edit: This is the relevant text from Jobbers World, a World Petroleum Inc. publication, Sept. 9, 2010: "Last week we reported that Honda awarded its Honda Genuine oil contract to ConocoPhillips. This business was formerly serviced by the long-time incumbent, ExxonMobil. Whereas this is bad news for ExxonMobil, it was certainly good news for ConocoPhillips. Further, as we said in our article breaking this story, its also good news for ConocoPhillips marketers since they will likely enjoy additional buyback business with ConocoPhillips as a result. . . . " )


WRT yr other q, yes, the "old" silver bottle was MC5K.
 

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Interesting. But our cars can take any oil, as long as it's the correct weight, right? I certainly haven't been putting Honda oil in - I thought they required their own only for the MT and DPF fluids, but I could have just missed it.
 

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Interesting. But our cars can take any oil, as long as it's the correct weight, right? I certainly haven't been putting Honda oil in - I thought they required their own only for the MT and DPF fluids, but I could have just missed it.
Pretty much, due to laws they can not limit your motor oil selection, just has to be the correct weight and specs. Now for those of us who have warranty, probably not worth saving $10 to loose the warranty. But when I get out of the warranty period I will be using whatever is on sale and fits the specs. I have done so with all my cars. None went to the graveyard due to engine failure/oil issues. It has always been something else (or like a dozen other stuff).
 

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Pretty much, due to laws they can not limit your motor oil selection, just has to be the correct weight and specs. Now for those of us who have warranty, probably not worth saving $10 to loose the warranty. But when I get out of the warranty period I will be using whatever is on sale and fits the specs. I have done so with all my cars. None went to the graveyard due to engine failure/oil issues. It has always been something else (or like a dozen other stuff).
You warranty is at zero risk using a non-Honda motor oil. As long as it meets Honda's specs and you have your receipts, you'll be fine. The specifications will be in your owner's manual.

Regarding the 0W20's, the older silver bottle, 08798-9029, was made by Idemitsu. Currently, ConocoPhilips makes 2 different 0W20 oils, a synthetic blend and a full synthetic, 08798-9036 and -9037.
 

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. . . Regarding the 0W20's, the older silver bottle, 08798-9029, was made by Idemitsu. . . . .
Jack, I believe the "silver bottle" that the OP asked about initially was Honda's conventional Exxon-Mobil Clean 5000 motor oil (which was sold by Honda in a silver bottle), and that's what I was referring to (above) when I answered his question. Your silver bottle (Idemitsu synthetic) came later and it was, as you stated, also sold in a silver bottle.

To coin a cliché, you can't tell the players without a score card.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
> Jack, I believe the "silver bottle" that the OP asked about initially was Honda's conventional Exxon-Mobil Clean 5000 motor oil

Yes. And mine's an 09 which takes the 5w20. So, I think this all definitely answers my questsions:
* The original spec oil for my car is Mobile Clean 5000.
* I can run MC 5000 for the MM interval (although I probably won't cuz I'm kind of a wusse).
* After I run out of MC 5000, I'll switch to Motorcraft Synthetic Blend which is the same as the new Conoco Philips 5w20 which is what's being sold with the Honda label now at the parts counter for my car.
 

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You warranty is at zero risk using a non-Honda motor oil. As long as it meets Honda's specs and you have your receipts, you'll be fine. The specifications will be in your owner's manual.
Exactly. Anyone who was paying more for "Honda" Oil, was just paying' for snake oil. Sucker born everyday!
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Honda service uses Penzoil (which bobistheoilguy members seem to like a lot) and they put the sticker right on the windshield.
The old oil was supposedly the same as MC5000.
The new oil is supposedly the same as Motorcraft Semi-Synthetic (which my other car uses anyway) which is also supposed to be a good Conoco oil and is reasonably priced for a semi-syn.
That's all I know. barryisnottheoilguy
 

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Honda service uses Penzoil
Often, dealers buy Bulk Oil. This will vary by dealer.

It's not necessarily the same as the bottles of "Honda Genuine" sold at the parts counter.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Indeed. I should have said "my dealer" instead of "the dealer."

It's fun to worry about oil but they're all so close now that I kinda let go on it and let the dealer put in what they want. It's not exactly a Shelby Mustang or anything. Our V's are so stout I'm sure it's pretty rare that they die from a motor oil related problem when the oil was changed as required and the car wasn't abused. Perhaps one of the techs can elaborate and/or disagree. I did hear of one model year where the heads went bad way more frequently than the specified failure rate. I wonder if that could have been cured by some fancy, synthetic. And (since I think it was a 2001 model), I wonder if the amount of money saved by not doing frequent changes with synthetic for 12 years would be more than the cost of the head rebuild.
Let's see...
Head rebuild was like $1500 -- non dealer but Honda specialized service.
Average miles per year, about 12K. Dork oil change rate 4K miles (probably 3K but I want to be generous).
5 quarts of cheap oil plus filter, 1.5 times a year = (15.00 + 6(filter) + 2(tax)) * 1.5 ~= 35.00/yr
5 quarts Mobil 1 plus filter, 3 times a year = (40.00 + 6 (filter) + 5 (tax)) * 3 = 153.00/yr

So, that's 12 * (153 - 35) = 1416. Pretty close to the cost of the head job, but not quite and a lot less trips to the shop. Interesting...

Just had some time to kill...
 

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Indeed. I should have said "my dealer" instead of "the dealer."
Let's see...
Head rebuild was like $1500 -- non dealer but Honda specialized service.
Average miles per year, about 12K. Dork oil change rate 4K miles (probably 3K but I want to be generous).
5 quarts of cheap oil plus filter, 1.5 times a year = (15.00 + 6(filter) + 2(tax)) * 1.5 ~= 35.00/yr
5 quarts Mobil 1 plus filter, 3 times a year = (40.00 + 6 (filter) + 5 (tax)) * 3 = 153.00/yr

So, that's 12 * (153 - 35) = 1416. Pretty close to the cost of the head job, but not quite and a lot less trips to the shop. Interesting...

Just had some time to kill...
Not sure about your math here. Why would you change the synthetic oil twice as often as the mineral oil? Friend of mine does one oil change per year (synthetic oil/filter) and does about 15K miles/year.
What about labor? are you working for free?
What am I missing?
 

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Perhaps Barry had a few too many martinis for lunch. :)
I believe he mixed up the Mobil 1 and the Cheap oil.
No taxes included in the next two lines:
Using Cheap oil---- $84/yr @ 4 changes a yr (at Barry's price of $3/qt)
Mobil 1--------------$89/yr @ 1-1/2 changes a yr (at Barry's price of $8/qt)
If you buy the 5qt jug of Mobil 1 at Walmart for around $30 inc taxes, the cost is less than the Cheap oil.
Buffalo4
 

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Oil is oil when it comes to off the shelf brands for the most part. Mobil, Pennzoil, Castrol, Motorcraft, etc... Buy whatever is on sale and use it as long as it meets Hondas specs. Synthetic is your best bet but you can save money and run semi synthetic as long as your vehicle is allowed to or even dino oil. Just change the oil when you are suppose to.

You really want to throw in a wrench, how many people have you seen on here or other car sites car forums bash FRAM oil filters? Guess who makes your Honda oil filter? Remember, Honda doesn't make anything but vehicle parts. They don't make oil, gear lube, transmission fluid, etc... They have them made for them so yes your "Honda" fluids are all someone else's and are pretty close to or the same as many other brands.
 

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Honda currently has two filter suppliers, Fram (A01) and Filtech (A02)

I personally wouldn't use whatever is on sale, if you are suggesting to use a different brand (potentially) at each change. The chances are extremely slim but if I ever have an oil related engine issue I have documented proof of who's oil has consistently been ran through my engine.
 
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