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With the help of Black Pearl’s photo essays I was able to do my oil change, air filters, and rear diff for my 2008 CR-V, all for $125 including buying a torque wrench, dealer wanted $280. I bought all my parts from H and A: http://www.handa-accessories.com/ and it was pretty straight forward.

-Rear Diff. Super easy, well worth doing on my own. It's only a few bucks in parts and the dealer wants $100. You do get a little dirty crawling under the car but I was able to do it w/o a ramp or anything to lift the car. It was a little hard getting the plugs out, make sure to take the fill one out first (in case you can’t get the drain out!) I will certainly do this again.

http://www.crvownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3324

-Air filters. Even easier. Cost me under $50 in parts, dealer wants $100. This you can do w/o getting dirty at all, very easy. I will do this again.

http://www.crvownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3279

-Oil change. Pretty simple in theory. You MUST have the right size socket to get the plug out. I tried for over an hour using a non-metric set, forget it. If you don’t have a 6 sided 17mm socket, get one. I thought I was going to strip mine trying to get it out. I didn’t have my car up on anything so there isn’t a lot of room and I had the dealer do my oil change last time and I think he put the plug back in with an air gun. I literally had to wedge my leg under the car onto the wrench and hold onto the drivers side tire with all my Viking might to get the plug to break it’s seal. I would also highly recommend some kind of cap to take the filter off, I could not take it off with my hand (maybe I’m just a weakling) and my ‘standard’ cap to remove it was not the right size. I’ll probably order one from h and a next time I order stuff. I was able to take it off with an item from my kitchen drawer, off of those pickle jar lid removers that is a strap you can tighten around the lid. It took quite a while and I can get an oil change for about $25, and the parts were about $15. This I probably won’t do again unless I want to get an oil sample.

http://www.crvownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3288

Ah yes, the oil sample! I was at about 10% on my MMI at 10,800 miles when I did this change and just didn’t know if that really is a good idea to wait this long, so I took the advice to ship an oil sample to Blackstone Labs: http://www.blackstone-labs.com/ It was really easy to do. They send you (for free, no shipping even) a little plastic bottle, with another little bottle in it. You fill the small bottle as your oil drains out, close it, wrap it in this absorbent material, put it into the bigger bottle, and put that whole thing in a zip lock bag with a check for $32.50. It’s only $22.50 for the regular analysis plus $10 more for their special something or other, I dunno. I just wanted them to do all the tests and tell me if my oil was still good or not! Put all that in a little box with peanuts and ship it out, cost about $5 for US priority mail. About 5 days later I got an email with a PDF file of my results. They also sent me my results via snail mail.
Pretty much they said I had some extra engine wear, and they would like to see me send them a sample at 9000 miles next time. I’m sure there is some other interesting stuff in the report for somebody that understands it, but just the info that 10% MMI was too long is the info I needed! My plan is to give it a try at 7,500 miles and send them the oil. Here is a link to the doc version of the report they sent me:
http://www.sniperd.com/files/oil.doc

Thanks Black Pearl for all your photos, couldn’t have done it w/o you. I owe you a beer, or approximately $280 - $125 worth of beer :)
 

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Thanks

SniperD thanks for the kind comments and also thanks for posting your lab report. Interesting! From what they are saying it seems as though we shouldn't wait as long as the MMI may indicate.

Thanks again for the kind comments.



 

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My '08 CR-V is coming up on its second oil change. I'm showing 20% remaining with approximately 20,800 miles. I'll do the Blackstone analysis and we'll compare results.

I've got Mobile 1 running in it right now. The first oil change was at around 10,800 miles. I'd have to look for sure, but I think I'm running the dreaded -02 OEM oil filter. :eek:

I think the scientific approach to this is interesting and educational. I'm planning on having my CR-V for at least 200,000 miles so I'd like to do what I can to keep it up to snuff.

I'm guessing it'll be another month or so until the next oil change. I'll keep everyone posted...

Rod
Loveland, Colorado
 

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Told you so...

Interesting! From what they are saying it seems as though we shouldn't wait as long as the MMI may indicate.
Told you so! Told you so! :p:p

This conclusion of waiting too long assumes that Blackstone is honest with no ulterior motive for more frequent samples. I believe that they are honest. If they were not they would lose the fleet accounts, their bread and butter. What criteria are they using to say you are waiting too long? The aluminum, copper and silicon particles compared to the huge data base? Playing the Devil's advocate, That may not apply if the engine was not yet fully broken-in at the last oil change (at 10k miles).

How CR-V and year specific is the data base the wear is compared too? The 2007 might be totally different than the 2006 or when ever a new model of the engine came out. My concern is how specific is it to that 2008 model CR-V?

In your case the Molybdenum was 194 compared to the universal number of 79. Not sure why that was not flagged.

When I do my first oil change I will send my Blackstone mailer in to get a baseline. This will give us a point at lower miles and at about one year on the factory fill oil. The Molybdenum should be way off the scale if what the Honda TSB indicates is true. My understanding is it is used both as a gauge of wear and oil condition. As the bearings wear molybdenum is given off while as the oil is used up the moly changes too.

Anyone know what you don't get at $22.50 that you do get at $32.50?

We shall see.

-Rg
 

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I will throw my meager opinion in there regarding this. I assume you were using plain old dino oil as it states Honda 5W20; it would be interesting to see the next OIA done with a synthetic oil and see if there were any changes in either the levels and\or recommendations. I changed to synthetic after my first oil change and have been using Penzoil Platinum 5W20 ever since and with MY driving conditions have never gotten lower than 9975 miles (and that was the first change) by following the MMS.

Now this has NO correlation to SniperD's report, I was just interested if a change to synthetic would make any difference.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I'm not sure what kind of oil was in the sample I sent as the dealer had done my first oil change. Now I've got the 'offical' honda 5w20 stuff from H and A. I'm curious to see how my next sample goes.
 

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SniperD - You will get more wear indication at first as this is part of the break-in process - all the high points of machined surfaces are worn off. The aluminum content is interesting - next sample should show a drop. Maybe this is why they develop piston slap when cold as the mileage builds up.
 

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Piston slap

BTW my understanding of why most piston slap occurs is due to collapse and wear of the piston skirts. As the piston rocks slightly in the bore slapping at TDC? Or is it BDC? Not due to significant cylinder bore or rod bearing wear.

In lesser cases it only occurs for a few seconds or until the piston warms up. Then it goes away. Therefore it is more frustrating than anything else. It does not do much harm nor should it be much cause for concern in an engine with 200,000 miles. It is one reason why new pistons are recommended during a rebuild. As opposed to just re-ringing the original piston that may otherwise be within specs for wear.

So I was told by a mechanical guru. I'm sure there are differing opinions out there. Please Air them out...

-Rg
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Interesting! Maybe as my car gets older I'll be able to extend my oil changes a bit. I'll make sure to post my 2nd sample results once I hit enough miles.
 

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Thanks for posting the UOA!

I agree though, I think it's worth investing in ramps ($35), a 17mm 6pt socket ($3), a 15" breaker bar ($30), and a filter wrench ($5) before doing the oil change again. For me, it's a $25/oil change difference between DIY and dealership - so, with about 8 total oil changes for all our vehicles combined every year, it was easily worth it.
 

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Thanks for posting the UOA!

I agree though, I think it's worth investing in ramps ($35), a 17mm 6pt socket ($3), a 15" breaker bar ($30), and a filter wrench ($5) before doing the oil change again. For me, it's a $25/oil change difference between DIY and dealership - so, with about 8 total oil changes for all our vehicles combined every year, it was easily worth it.
LOL, I felt like I should have used a breaker bar after my first oil change too!

I was hoping to see a better UOA report as I have been following the MMI too, although I'm using synthetic oil.

Radar24, Just curious, are you using synthetic or dino and at what mileage are you changing your oil?
 

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Radar24, Just curious, are you using synthetic or dino and at what mileage are you changing your oil?
My '08 CR-V still has the original factory fill oil. It was at 60% last I checked. A year is coming up soon and I am anxious to change it ASAP. Probably will have only about 5,000 when I change it since we hardly drove it the first few months.

I prefer using Mobil1 5w20 0r 0w30. What ever brand that I can find locally known to be 100% PAO Group IV will be fine. Except for Castrol Syntech; I am boycotting them. As of a few weeks ago Costco only carried Mobil 5w30 or 10w30. Not 5w20. BJ's is about the same. I have not checked at Wal-Mart yet. Unfortunately they frequently sell out of certain grades.

I have been using Mibil1 5w30 lately on my other vehicles. If I can get it I think I will switch to the Extended Service Mobil1 from now on.

-Rg
 

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My '08 CR-V still has the original factory fill oil. It was at 60% last I checked. A year is coming up soon and I am anxious to change it ASAP. Probably will have only about 5,000 when I change it since we hardly drove it the first few months.

I prefer using Mobil1 5w20 0r 0w30. What ever brand that I can find locally known to be 100% PAO Group IV will be fine. Except for Castrol Syntech; I am boycotting them. As of a few weeks ago Costco only carried Mobil 5w30 or 10w30. Not 5w20. BJ's is about the same. I have not checked at Wal-Mart yet. Unfortunately they frequently sell out of certain grades.

I have been using Mibil1 5w30 lately on my other vehicles. If I can get it I think I will switch to the Extended Service Mobil1 from now on.

-Rg
My local WalMart sells the M1 EP in 5w-20(5 qt jugs and 1 qt bottles) but I can't remember the price. You do know about the $10 rebate from Mobil don't you? I have already printed a couple of the forms and plan to pick up some M1 EP for future changes. Have you had any experience with the Pennzoil Platinum? A lot of people really praise that stuff on the "bob oil guy" forum.


I have been running M1 in my 99 4wd Tacoma for several years with good results. Last month Advance Auto was running a special....5 qts of any Mobil 1(including the EP) and a M1 oil fliter for $29.....thought that was a pretty good price.
 

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With the rebate that would end up being $19/qt! I have not seen M1 at less than $4/qt in a long time.

And yes I did know about the rebate. Looks like Mobil has excess oil production or is trying to corner the market. Or get rid of the competition so they can raise prises at will. After all the oil companies have tremendous profits leftover from when the barrel was nearly $150/barrel. What would be better use of the profits than to use it to eliminate most of the independent competition. Then the few remaining big companies can all raise prises. Just a brain fart!

I have never used the PennZOil synthetic other than the occasional quart to top off when nothing else was available. The container looks pretty...

BTW I don't put much stock in "I never had any Problems" accolades. It does indicate no negative feedback but if the oil is being changed every 3k or even 5k miles the accolade does not amount to much. If they trade it in every 3 years it does not mean much. The cheapest oil, even recycled oil should last that long! Follow my drift?

A lot of us praise a product with infatuation and do not do it objectively. Sometimes it might be the only product ever used having no familiarity with the competition.

As an example GM used to have the market share of production in the US with one of the highest loyalty rates. Buyers would not buy another product even though in many cases some of the competition had a superior product, price or reliability. Loyalty makes them give good accolade and the fact that the engine or A/T has been changed several times does not matter. They will continue to buy GM as if it was normal to have all these problems. I know people like that.

On the other hand an ex Toyota customer that bough a Honda was all flustered wanting to go back to Toyota when the steel wheels showed signs of rust. That was sufficient to have him want to switch back to Toyota.

In other words some Toyota and Honda buyers have a much lower level of loyalty. So it seems, so the surveys seem to indicate.. :rolleyes: The rusted wheels might be just an isolated problem. Possibly a vendor problem or even use of the wrong cleaning product. Who really knows what the problem was?

So lately I have been trying to be more skeptical of accolades. I have no problem at all being skeptical of manufacturer's product claims.

-Rg
 

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I was hoping to see a better UOA report as I have been following the MMI too, although I'm using synthetic oil.
Im not quite convinced that the UOA is suboptimal. The car has 20k miles in it, and a run from 10k-20k could certainly still contain wear from break in process, which can cause wear metals and Si to be higher. Another UOA would be very helpful to establish a trend.
 

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Im not quite convinced that the UOA is suboptimal. The car has 20k miles in it, and a run from 10k-20k could certainly still contain wear from break in process, which can cause wear metals and Si to be higher. Another UOA would be very helpful to establish a trend.
I agree the analysis is not conclusive other than indicating nothing is grossly going wrong. On the other hand the baseline has to be established at some point.

I will get an analysis myself at a much lower mileage to establish the baseline or trend earlier. Some might think it is a waste. That might be so only if there are no problems indicated. But in general that is how this game is played. Right?


It at least gives me in indication of how much breaking-in or wear that is going on. This info might be useful later on with Warranty claims. Particularly if engine problems develop.

-Rg
 

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With the rebate that would end up being $19/qt! I have not seen M1 at less than $4/qt in a long time.

And yes I did know about the rebate. Looks like Mobil has excess oil production or is trying to corner the market. Or get rid of the competition so they can raise prises at will. After all the oil companies have tremendous profits leftover from when the barrel was nearly $150/barrel. What would be better use of the profits than to use it to eliminate most of the independent competition. Then the few remaining big companies can all raise prises. Just a brain fart!

I have never used the PennZOil synthetic other than the occasional quart to top off when nothing else was available. The container looks pretty...

BTW I don't put much stock in "I never had any Problems" accolades. It does indicate no negative feedback but if the oil is being changed every 3k or even 5k miles the accolade does not amount to much. If they trade it in every 3 years it does not mean much. The cheapest oil, even recycled oil should last that long! Follow my drift?

A lot of us praise a product with infatuation and do not do it objectively. Sometimes it might be the only product ever used having no familiarity with the competition.

As an example GM used to have the market share of production in the US with one of the highest loyalty rates. Buyers would not buy another product even though in many cases some of the competition had a superior product, price or reliability. Loyalty makes them give good accolade and the fact that the engine or A/T has been changed several times does not matter. They will continue to buy GM as if it was normal to have all these problems. I know people like that.

On the other hand an ex Toyota customer that bough a Honda was all flustered wanting to go back to Toyota when the steel wheels showed signs of rust. That was sufficient to have him want to switch back to Toyota.

In other words some Toyota and Honda buyers have a much lower level of loyalty. So it seems, so the surveys seem to indicate.. :rolleyes: The rusted wheels might be just an isolated problem. Possibly a vendor problem or even use of the wrong cleaning product. Who really knows what the problem was?

So lately I have been trying to be more skeptical of accolades. I have no problem at all being skeptical of manufacturer's product claims.

-Rg
I guess I should have said many Platinum users are posting some very respectable UOA reports. I agree, the Platinum does have a fancy looking bottle!
 

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I wonder if the UOA would have apeared better had the O/P been using a synthetic oil? Of course I'm assuming that he was not using a synthetic since his first change was done at the dealer.
 

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I agree the analysis is not conclusive other than indicating nothing is grossly going wrong. On the other hand the baseline has to be established at some point.

I will get an analysis myself at a much lower mileage to establish the baseline or trend earlier. Some might think it is a waste. That might be so only if there are no problems indicated. But in general that is how this game is played. Right?


It at least gives me in indication of how much breaking-in or wear that is going on. This info might be useful later on with Warranty claims. Particularly if engine problems develop.

-Rg
I like UOAs. However, I'd just note that UOAs early in an engine's life usually contain higher wear metals even when everything is just fine, and it's not worth being disappointed because of wear metals on one single UOA at this time.
 

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Understood. I think we kind of beat this UOA thing on new engines to death.

Any new opinions are welcome of course. :)

-Rg
 
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