Honda CR-V Owners Club Forums banner

Is it possible to disable the limp mode / function?

19K views 36 replies 8 participants last post by  siannich  
#1 ·
It might be a controversial question, but is it possible at all to electronically disable the limp mode function?
Whilst the limp mode could at times be preventable by i.e. maintaining fuel above the minimum level etc., it tends to turn on in my CRV67 whenever the Check System warning light comes on (not always but often), as if the engine was trying to save itself from something. In my experience, sudden change to limp mode which is making the car very sluggish and barely responsive on the road, can in some situations be very dangerous i.e. driving on a motorway or dual carriageway and being overtaken by lorries at 50-55mph when the car's acceleration in a limp mode would be significantly below normal acceleration level.
Any ideas/tips on that topic?
 
#3 ·
Limp mode cannot be deactivated on automotive applications, but when said engines are used in an emergency power supply situation then the ECM can be configured to run to destruction thus switching off the limp mode.

Concerning your comments you will be given many warning signs and driving indicators before limp mode will will have been activated – At the end of the day limp mode is to protect the engine / vehicle, hence if you have this issue on your motor I would be investigating why – Best guess being as you have not supplied any details is the your EGR or DPF system is blocked.
 
#5 ·
Thanks for the replies. Just to give you a bit more background and details. The car was checked for faults a few weeks ago and that revealed an error code of the air to fuel sensor, which had to be replaced (Cost ca.ÂŁ1,2k). After that, the warning light was reset and did not come on again until a few days ago. As soon as the ''Check System'' Warning Light came on, the limp mode got triggered during driving. Next day, when I was driving the car, the warning light was still on, but the limp mode disappeared and I could drive as normal. A week later, the car was diagnosed again for other errors and this identified an error with low pressure EGR, which now needs to be taken out and checked more directly to asses whether it is faulty and if so, it will require either repair or replacement. The check of EGR itself was quoted as ca. ÂŁ500 something. The garage said that most probably, the EGR issue has been an knock-on effect from the previous air to fuel sensor issue. This repair / replacement to EGR has not happened yet and the warning light was reset, but I anticipate - since the EGR error was already identified - the warning light can come on any minute (with a possible Limp Mode). The upcoming check of EGR should identify the next course of action.

Anyway, from the general perspective, it is fairly obvious to me that in case of warning lights, these need diagnosing / checking and sorting, but the fundamental question in my mind - deriving from this situation - is whether in your experience the ''Check System'' Warning Light and the Limp Mode can be triggered only by a serious factor / reason, where there is a real danger of i.e. damaging the engine or it could be triggered by a trivial factor, such as a small error in the electronic system, which can reset itself by turning the engine off and on or by reseting in a different way, if possible at all?
 
#6 ·
@M4R3K-CRV67
I have entered my comments in red below, also could you answer the questions.

Thanks for the replies. Just to give you a bit more background and details. The car was checked for faults a few weeks ago and that revealed an error code of the air to fuel sensor, (Are you talking about the MAP sensor?) which had to be replaced (Cost ca.ÂŁ1,2k). After that, the warning light was reset and did not come on again until a few days ago.

As soon as the ''Check System'' Warning Light came on, the limp mode got triggered during driving. (Which warning light sign came on see screen shots below) Next day, when I was driving the car, the warning light was still on, but the limp mode disappeared (again which warning sign) and I could drive as normal. A week later, the car was diagnosed again for other errors (What error please explain) and this identified an error with low pressure EGR, which now needs to be taken out and checked more directly to assess whether it is faulty (Sounds like a blocked EGR valve) and if so, it will require either repair or replacement. The check of EGR itself was quoted as ca. ÂŁ500 something. The garage said that most probably, the EGR issue has been a knock-on effect from the previous air to fuel sensor issue. (I would like to see the test results of the MAP sensor) This repair / replacement to EGR has not happened yet and the warning light was reset, but I anticipate - since the EGR error was already identified - the warning light can come on any minute (with a possible Limp Mode). The upcoming check of EGR should identify the next course of action. (Until the problem is correctly identified then yes limp mode is certainly going to happen)
Anyway, from the general perspective, it is fairly obvious to me that in case of warning lights, these need diagnosing / checking and sorting,(Yes I agree) but the fundamental question in my mind - deriving from this situation - is whether in your experience the ''Check System'' Warning Light and the Limp Mode can be triggered only by a serious factor / reason, where there is a real danger of i.e. damaging the engine or it could be triggered by a trivial factor, such as a small error in the electronic system, which can reset itself by turning the engine off and on or by resetting in a different way, if possible at all?
I cannot comment on the underlined comments until the problem is identified correctly and fixed.

My questions to you; are you aware of any fault codes to help diagnose the problem?

Image
 
#7 ·
@UK-Kev many thanks for your comments.
Here are the responses to your questions:

-(Are you talking about the MAP sensor?) - The sensor, I am talking about, that had to be replaced by the garage was defined as: ''AIR FUEL RATIO SENSOR''. Not sure if MAP, you are talking about, would be the same. Tried to search it in the Honda Book, but couldn't find anything on sensors really. I presume MAP stands for Manifold Absolute Pressure Sensor, but looking at prices of this on Google, they oscillate around tens of ÂŁ, whereas the dealer cost of the aforementioned ''AIR FUEL RATIO SENSOR'' was above ÂŁ700.
-(Which warning light sign came on see screen shots below) - it was neither of the signs on your screenshots. It was Malfunction Indicator Lamp with associated text / display: ''CHECK SYSTEM'' - see attached dashboard photo (the screenshot below does not show a great deal).

-(What error please explain) - the car was being checked / scanned in the garage, I understand using a diagnostic tool, for any errors that might have caused the warning light to go on. This revealed low pressure EGR error, from what the Garage confirmed to me.
-(Sounds like a blocked EGR valve) - yes, it sounds like that although the garage said that they need to fully remove the low pressure EGR and then check it to see if it's definitely this. BTW, the quote for removal and check is in excess of ÂŁ400, which sounds quite substantial just for a check. The quote for EGR repair/replacement has not been given, as they don't know yet until it's removed and checked. Does this sound credible to you? Could in this case the best scenario be a blocked EGR, in which case cleaning would do the trick and the worst case scenario a complete EGR replacement? Any idea of expected cost for the latter?
-(I would like to see the test results of the MAP sensor) - I am not sure if it was or it wasn't tested. I assume it was, but I haven't been given by the garage any physical evidence such as a printout with testing results etc. Are you suggesting that the garage should have given to me a proof of which errors have been identified on a sheet of paper or in any other physical form? Not sure if that would be their usual practice.
-I cannot comment on the underlined comments until the problem is identified correctly and fixed - Noted & understood.
-''My questions to you; are you aware of any fault codes to help diagnose the problem?'' - the only fault codes displayed on my dashboard were as I explained above: Malfunction Indicator Lamp with associated text / display: ''CHECK SYSTEM'' - see attached dashboard photo. There were no other fault/error codes displayed on the dashboard. As a matter of fact, after the recent visit in the garage, and after I was told that the issue seems to be with low pressure EGR etc., I am currently having no error codes displayed anywhere on the dashboard (they must have been reset after the recent diagnostic session), but I anticipate ''CHECK SYSTEM'' warning light may come up again any minute i.e. when the engine gets hot after a few miles driven, which happened before.

Anyway, the above are my answers to the questions you have asked. Any thoughts on my further questions, I have asked above? Any thoughts/tips will be appreciated.
 
#9 ·
Hi UK-Kev, just to update you on the latest with the estimate for the testing/checking/diagnosing & replacement of the low pressure EGR Unit, it is now ca. ÂŁ1,4k. The garage is still unsure whether this will fix the problem, although the diagnostics points at EGR as a cause of the problem. BTW, dealing with warranty company is an absolute disaster in its own right from day 1 of owning this car. I dread to think what else could be the problem, if this replacement does not fix it, and how much it will cost.
 
#11 ·
It is the price for a new EGR replacement. Whether a repair could fix the problem was my first and immediate question to them, but the garage stated that they are suspecting faulty electrical part of the EGR Unit and therefore it is risky for them to pull out all the electrics etc. (however this can be interpreted), so full replacement had to be considered.
 
#12 ·
@M4R3K-CRV67

So, the cost has gone up considerably from the original quote – Personally I think the garage you are working with is what I call “Fit the New” and hope the problem goes away and no proper diagnostic of the problem.

Just done a quick search on ebay and you could get a used EGR valve with a 3 month warranty for ÂŁ106 quid and get a local garage to fit it.
LINK

Pull your car away from this garage and get the JLM doctor team involved, or similar team to visit you at home and clean your DPF and EGR using their cleaning method’s.

From my experience using a team like above, or even doing it yourself you will be saving yourself a future.
 
#13 ·
UK-Kev
Unfortunately, your conclusion about the garage is pretty much the same as mine at present (probably a bit to late). For this exact reason, I posted not long ago an open question on the forum to ask about independent garages in my area (Nottingham) who would know CRVs inside out, with not much response received. I had in previous years a lot of experience with other of my cars which were being repaired by ''so called good garages'' with a good rating on Google etc. and they would often fit into the “Fit the New” category, as opposed to some other garages (independent specialists such as for Volvo or Renault, which I had at the time) that - firstly were much better than dealership's service - and could always locate problems much quicker, they new what was going on with the car and as a result, they were saving me money instead of draining my budget for i.e. unnecessary replacements of new units etc. Sadly, that post didn't get much response plus there is a peculiar warranty arrangement ( a disaster in its own right), I currently have, which has - to some degree - tied me to the current garage in some way. Anyway, lessons learned!

Thanks for the link to the used EGR and for mentioning the JLM Doctor Team. I gather you (or someone you know) has used the JLM Doctors. Is that right? Could you send through some details, in case I consider using them in future, although I have seriously started thinking of changing the car, because clearly in my experience its sketchy reliability record is making me losing the will to live at the moment, unless the predominant factor here is not the car per sei, but the garage not knowing exactly what's wrong and trying various fixes on the basis of the ''third time lucky'' principle. The jury is out on this one in my mind, at the moment.
 
#14 ·
@M4R3K-CRV67

To try and answer your question “I gather you (or someone you know) has used the JLM Doctors. Is that right?” I have worked with diesel and other types of engines for many years, thus gaining the experience and training roles within the automotive industry. However, to answer your question I have known many folks in your position and directed them to the specialized cleaning teams who conduct this work and give you a warranty. The last guy I helped with a similar problem to yourself was DC2 (I think) on this forum who conducted the cleaning work himself – Please do your own reading on the link below.

https://www.crvownersclub.com/search/1577007/?q=DPF+clean&t=post&c[child_nodes]=1&c[nodes][0]=74&o=relevance

If you have any other specific questions, please do not hesitate to ask and I will endeavour to help.
 
#17 ·
Hi Kev,

I have further feedback regarding my CRV following on from last year's replacement of low pressure EGR. It would seem that the replacement has initially addressed the issue; however after several months the issue with ''Check Engine'' or ''Check System'' dashboard notifications coming up on the dashboard started again. Over the last 6 months or so, I have observed the following pattern: ''Without any apparent reason, the orange warning light ''Check Engine'' or ''Check System'' comes up and at this point limp mode always kicks in and it feels like the car engine is losing something like 80% of power. Recently, whenever this occurred, I started the ''procedure'' of pulling out of the road, turning the engine off, waiting a few minutes, then turning the engine on and driving off. In all cases, the engine power was back on and felt normal after restarting. The orange warning light typically remained on the dashboard for about 2-3 days, but during that time the car was driving just fine, with no issues. Then, typically after a couple of days, the orange warning light would simply disappear from the dashboard and it seemed that there is no problem at all. After a certain period of time (usually a few weeks), the orange warning light ''Check Engine'' or ''Check System'' would come up again, and I would typically do the same with pulling out, restarting engine to come out of the limp mode, and continued to drive, as the engine seemed OK and again after a couple of days, the warning light would come off, until it came back again after a few weeks and so on and so forth. This basically seemed to be a very repetitive pattern, which I have associated with a temporary error, which was every time resolved by itself.''

Interestingly, a couple of days ago, I was on a longer motorway trip and the orange warning light came up again, which - as in previous cases - made me pull the car on the hardshoulder to restart the engine to regain the power and to continue driving further. As this was a bit of a longer than usual journey, say around 200 miles or so, the orange warning light ''Check System'' was continuously on through most of the journey. After 1st restart, the engine power was fully back on, but then I noticed another pattern. As I continued driving with normal engine power (after 1st restart), the limp mode kicked in, which again made me pull out onto hardshoulder or emergency layby to do the restart. Over the remaining part of the journey (ca.90miles), I had probably 4 or 5 instances where limp mode kicked in, then I had to stop, restart the engine to re-gain normal power only to lose it again after next 15 minutes and the process of pulling out and restarting etc. repeated 4 or 5 times. After 1 day, the warning light is still on, but the engine power is back on at normal level. I am expecting that the light will go off after another couple of days and will probably re-appear after a few weeks, as this seems to be a very repetitive vicious cycle.

When my car had an MOT done some 3 months ago, it was done in my trusted garage, as opposed to the one I was previously in (the one that was previously testing the problem in question and replaced the low pressure EGR etc.), my mechanic couldn't find any obvious fault anywhere, although he thought that this time it may possibly be a high pressure EGR at fault, but he wasn't 100% sure about that and hence has honestly admitted that he wouldn't recommend any expensive replacements at this time without investigating it further. He checked it on the diagnostic tool and reset the orange warning light, which went off, and everything with the car was fine until the ''vicious cycle'' started again after a month or so and seems to be repeating as a pattern already described above.

I continue to wonder from the very beginning of this issue occurring in my CRV, whether this orange warning light ''Check Engine'' or ''Check System'' is activated by a really trivial issue, like a momentary short circuit or something that triggers it due to a minor electronic fault or something along those lines. It's interesting that there is a range of different types of warning lights that can be triggered, but they never ever came up, only those 2 ''Check Engine'' or ''Check System'', which seem to indicate a fault of a general nature (could be anything, everything or nothing), as I understand it.

I am beginning ''to lose the will to live'' with this car, having that issue reocurring in this vicious cycle again and again, as it is really annoying, especially that it has a tendency to kick in at the start of a motorway journey, at which point the limp mode kicks in and puts the car and the passengers in a very dangerous situation from safety perspective. To give some user perspective, which obviously will be very subjective, I used to own a Renault Grand Scenic (turbo diesel) and over the period of 12 years something like a loss of engine power during a motorway journey was something very exceptional and occurred no more than 2-3 times, then the problem was quickly identified and fixed (by my very trusted mechanic who knew Renault cars inside out). In my current Honda CRV, over only the last 2 years of ownership, I recorded probably more than 30 (if not more than that) occurrences when there is an unknown or unclear fault, with orange warning light coming up suddenly and triggering limp mode, stripping the car engine from 80% of normal power etc., very often on a busy motorway seriously compromising traffic safety at that point.

Given so repetitive pattern of this issue, I think one can imagine how annoying (and how expensive) would it be to go to a garage, every time this occurs, to do a diagnostic check, which very often in my case did not indicate anything obvious. I wonder how many CRV users had a same/similar experience with their cars?

Any thoughts on the above? Do you recon that giving a shot with JLM Doctors to check/clean DPF would be a good idea, knowing that there has not been any clear indication of any DPF related faults so far? Any rough idea of the cost of it?
 
#15 ·
Think about in the past we never had something like limp mode, engines ran fine, this is a money making scheme by honda, this the last honda i will ever possess. You end spending to tons going in and out of the dealer. We also never had an engine check light in those days and we our engines survived fine then. There too much electronics in engines nowadays causing most of the problems.
 
#16 ·
Firstly, it's not just a Honda thing. Every manufacturer uses the same system now. So don't bother buying a new car again, from anyone.

Secondly, all the old cars never used to run fuel injection or systems, so yea, they used to run till they blew up, but they had performance issues, you just didn't know about it because there was no light on the dashboard to tell you so.
 
#18 ·
If this was my car I would buy a cheapish scanner and carry it in the car with you. When your check engine light comes on, pull over somewhere safe, leave the engine running and scan codes.

Make a note of the code, and reset and drive again till the light comes back on, same procedure, pull over somewhere else, scan a code ( see if it's the same code) and report back.

If you are in a vicious cycle, it won't take long to gather data for people to help you further.
 
#20 ·
If this was my car I would buy a cheapish scanner and carry it in the car with you. When your check engine light comes on, pull over somewhere safe, leave the engine running and scan codes.

Make a note of the code, and reset and drive again till the light comes back on, same procedure, pull over somewhere else, scan a code ( see if it's the same code) and report back.

If you are in a vicious cycle, it won't take long to gather data for people to help you further.
Thanks for your suggestion. An recommendations with regards to the brand or type of scanner I should look for? I am guessing there is a multitude of them on the market and some would be more suitable than others.
 
#26 ·
Have a look at this website they have scanners / ODBII service tool equipment to suit everybody’s price range.

Diagnostic World - Code Reader - Reset Tool - Scan Tool - BUY ONLINE
Further to your suggestion, I got very recently from the above website the iCarsoft JPV2.0 (mid range) tester, so if any errors / warning lights reappear, I will give a go with scanning.

That said, I have recently had the clutch in my Honda replaced and looks like the garage did a very good job. As the ''Check Engine'' warning light was displaying on the dashboard just before the replacement work, I mentioned it to the mechanic. Just after the clutch replacement, the fault was diagnosed / checked etc. and eventually no warning lights were displaying any longer. The mechanic said that it is possible that the faulty / deteriorated clutch may have been attributable to the warning light, which made me think that since the clutch deterioration itself hasn't happened over night, but over a period of time, thinking retrospectively now, the issues with the warning light may have been potentially caused by the clutch all along over the past 2 years or so. No one will know that for sure, but all seems OK now, fingers crossed! In case it happens again, I will test the newly purchased scanner.
 
#22 ·
I like you am having issues with my 66 plate CRV and I'm so frustrated with it all. After taking it to a local garage back in Jan 23, they 'repaired it' for it to a week later, then have the same warning light appear again. I took the car back on 3 occasions they then decided it was the mass air flow sensor and in total charged me ÂŁ1300. I decided to never use the garage again and took it to my nearest Honda garage who charged just short of ÂŁ900 and they sorted it out. The car was fine until Dec where it went into limp mode with my 2 young children in the car on a very busy dual carriageway. So frightening, I called AA who reset it and followed me back to the Honda garage I used previously and it was looked it by them the following morning. They recommended changing the battery as they had said it worked well on a vehicle they fixed before. Up until this evening all was fine, but as you will guess, it went into limp mode again. I had been driving for around 10mins at 70mph and then came to slow down at a junction and limp mode kicked in again. I'm losing every faith in the car now and just don't know what else to do!! It's now becoming so unreliable, I don't dare drive anywhere too far!!
 
#23 ·
@Danielle27
Danielle,

Hello and welcome to the forum.

The best advice I can give you is to contact a local mechanic and get them to do a diagnostic test on CRV and let us know if you your CRV has any active/inactive diagnostic codes – Other information that would help if you could provide the exhaust DPF particulate matter valve – Please note the PM value is normally given in grams.

Further to the above we need to know whether you are just doing short distance driving and what your CRV service history is like and the miles it has covered.

The more information you can provide will help us to help you.

I am presuming from your original message that you have a 2016 earth dreams 1.6 iDTEC, can you please provide the other details…. Thanks.
 
#31 ·
@UK-Kev,
Here is a further update on the above....

The warning light ''Check System'' came on again''. This happened after a 20min motorway journey and immediately triggered a limp mode.
Next day, I have connected my new JP V2.0 Scanner next day, as the fault was still displaying, to check for errors.
I ran separately ''Auto Scan'' and ''Quick Scan'', but results were the same in both.

The scanner has displayed the following faults:

After initial Auto Scan the following general fault appeared:
''Engine (Diesel/PGM F1 - Programmed Fuel Injection)

Then after clicking on the initial fault, the following information was shown:
''P049B
Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) B Insufficient Flow
POSSIBLE FAILURE
Low pressure EGR line clogging
EGR filter clogging
Low pressure EGR cooler clogging
EGR differential pressure sensor range / performance problem
EGR differential pressure sensor sensor downstream side hose comes off
Air cleaner element clogging
Muffler crashed''

I'll add that, as I explained previously, this car had new Low Pressure EGR replaced 2 years ago.

The scanner gave me an option to reset this fault, so I did and the warning light disappeared, but I suspect the very reason why it came up in the first place may be related to any of the above items.

Any thoughts / suggestions of the best course of action with that issue going forward?
 
#33 ·
Hi, I posted a reply to this error code but never got a reply.

Please see #5 on this link >>> https://www.crvownersclub.com/threads/egr-valve.229718/#post-1763803

And this link from the above link >>> P049B Exhaust Gas Recirculation B Flow Insufficient Detected

Let me know how you get on.
Hi,
Sorry, I must have missed your previous link earlier on.
Thanks for the details - sounds like a lot of hassle to me with the extensive EGR work potentially needed, given that a fully new EGR was replaced in my car less than 2 years ago. Will discuss it with my trusted mechanic and will take it from there.
BTW, what do you mean by ''Italian Road Test''? Tried to Google it, but couldn't find any references other that relating to Italian Driving Licence tests etc.
 
#36 ·
Here is a further update on the previous issues with ''Check Engine Warning Light'' triggering Limp Mode issues that were caused by EGR (as per diagnostic reading), I had an annual service done back in May and - as part of that - the EGR Valve was cleaned with some good results. The recent EGR cleaning combined with permanent switching from regular diesel to high quality diesel fuels (Shell V-Power Diesel or Gulf Super Diesel) has made a massive difference. Over the last 2 months or so, I had only one instance of having ''Check Engine Warning Light'' triggering Limp Mode issue, which went away by itself after 2 days. I am going to continue monitoring the car's performance / behaviour going forward, but it is safe to say that there has been a significant improvement with currently none or very small / isolated number of episodes in comparison to what was being noted before which were several episodes in a scale of a month of ''Check Engine Warning Light'' with Limp Mode. After the recent improvement, I became a bit more optimistic that the aforementioned issue, if it comes up, it does so much less frequently than before, so there is ''a light in the tunnel'' with this issue, as it became more manageable and less annoying.
 
#37 ·
M4R3K please keep posting your updates. I have exactly the same problems. It is bad enough the engine warning lights coming on, but going into limp mode can be highly dangerous in some driving situations. Two garages have run diagnostics and both say it is an EGR fault but neither wanted to attempt a repair. I understand the EGR is very inaccessible and access can involve lifting the engine off its mountings. I have lost faith in the car and would love to get rid of it but who would want to buy it with these problems?
I am using high quality diesel which seemed better initially, but strangely the problems recur when the fuel tank gets down to half full. I am trying additives for general cleaning, injector cleaning (neither helped) and now DPF cleaning.
Your initial question about disabling limp mode would go a long way to making the car drivable but that does not appear to be possible.
TBH I feel like driving the beast through Honda's showroom window but I fear limp mode would kick in before impact and I would achieve little more than a gentle tap!
It seems manufacturers have created a fault detection system so complicated that even they themselves don't know understand it.
I will not be buying a Honda again, that for certain.